India Indian Military ORBAT and Wargaming

[Afif]

wargaming project.

Is it still available in PDF?

 

[Joe Shearer]

I believe hellfire2006 (the new one) is the fella that worked with us a bit during the wargaming project.

The old hellfire (the army veteran) is different person. Haven't seen him online much, but I havent been checking in much in various spots lately either.

Same name in the war game?

Incidentally, I've been stalling any re-start, since without a team, it will fall right into the jaws of Desert Fox (he calls himself something else now, Raja Porus).

Need volunteers.

I also think that the 2030 time frame, that we had used earlier, needs updating, since India has announced so many changes. I had in mind a division by commands, as being discussed, then into an expanded space based on realistic numbers, in terms of head-count as well as estimated budgets.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Is it still available in PDF?

No, being offered anew.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Is it still available in PDF?

Sorry, maybe I misunderstood.

Whatever was done until we all abandoned it due to other preoccupations must still be there.

Nothing new has happened.

It has been offered again, and Desert Fox (=Raja Porus) is champing at the bit to start. Immediately.

 

[Afif]

Okay, this is going totally over my head. Previously @Nilgiri once mentioned it vaguely. I assumed it is something from PDF. But I have no idea about it. Can you please explain it little more?

 

[Joe Shearer]

Okay, this is going totally over my head. Previously @Nilgiri once mentioned it vaguely. I assumed it is something from PDF. But I have no idea about it. Can you please explain it little more?

Yup.
Oscar, aka SQ8, had an electronic simulation of war, that listed various well-known weapons systems, and vessels and vehicles and aircraft, and handled encounters according to an internal algorithm.
Both sides had to declare their force composition, that had to pass muster by Panzerkiel for realism, and then make moves. When a clash occurred, the game would calculate casualties, and return a figure.
<more>

 

[Joe Shearer]

So both sides detailed their formations, defined the movement of these formations, and planned and executed air and sea attacks. There was a tremendous battle in the air, and significant numbers of aircraft were mowed down, both of the IAF and the PAF, with very strange figures emerging. Another battle took place on ground , with Pakistan Army 200 kms range ballistic missiles wreaking havoc in our accumulated logistics parks, but the main battle had not yet started. At sea, the Pakistan Navy struck first and struck hard, and caused casualties among our surface vessels.

We had not initiated our strategic strikes, nor our main ground attack, when the game was suspended.

 

[Afif]

Totally go it. But please don’t give up on me yet. Cause I have no idea what/who Oscar aka SQ8 is.

 

[Nilgiri]

Is it still available in PDF?

I believe the thread will expire along with the original forum. I would expect the main guy (Oscar) will have saved the work done to bring it out again when the next effort gains muster.

Have to see where Oscar settles and establishes now. Then the Pak side had strong interested members like Joe mentions with Desert Fox, Signalian, Gryphon and a couple others.

Same name in the war game?

Incidentally, I've been stalling any re-start, since without a team, it will fall right into the jaws of Desert Fox (he calls himself something else now, Raja Porus).

Need volunteers.

I also think that the 2030 time frame, that we had used earlier, needs updating, since India has announced so many changes. I had in mind a division by commands, as being discussed, then into an expanded space based on realistic numbers, in terms of head-count as well as estimated budgets.

Yes he was hellfire in the wargame, joined PDF around that same time I think.

We should start with smaller test engagements that can mimic some variety of skirmishes (concerning each branch) this time before we scale into bigger things.

Okay, this is going totally over my head. Previously @Nilgiri once mentioned it vaguely. I assumed it is something from PDF. But I have no idea about it. Can you please explain it little more?

It was an effort to simulate a conventional war between India and Pakistan in CMO (Command modern operations). The scale was very vast (so the program would run into some efforts/ freeze), we will have to break it down into smaller chunks to iron out problems at smaller scales first I think.

Elements of the effort also appeared here on this forum:

Indian Military ORBAT and Wargaming

(Space Reserved)

defencehub.live

Which I will update again later (when the new effort is ongoing/completed) for benefit of interested members here.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Totally go it. But please don’t give up on me yet. Cause I have no idea what/who Oscar aka SQ8 is.

An old-timer on PDF.
In my personal rating, the three most respect-worthy members, in terms of general character and integrity, were 'niaz', 'Fatman17', who is a member here, to my absolute delight, and a much younger person who had this very awkward habit of changing his id every three months or so. His latest was SQ8, but we first met him in his avatar of 'Oscar'.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Have to see where Oscar settles and establishes now. Then the Pak side had strong interested members like Joe mentions with Desert Fox, Signalian, Gryphon and a couple others.

You forgot the Major, 'Panzerkiel'. A very good man, an officer and a gentleman.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I believe the thread will expire along with the original forum. I would expect the main guy (Oscar) will have saved the work done to bring it out again when the next effort gains muster.

Have to see where Oscar settles and establishes now. Then the Pak side had strong interested members like Joe mentions with Desert Fox, Signalian, Gryphon and a couple others.



Yes he was hellfire in the wargame, joined PDF around that same time I think.

We should start with smaller test engagements that can mimic some variety of skirmishes (concerning each branch) this time before we scale into bigger things.



It was an effort to simulate a conventional war between India and Pakistan in CMO (Command modern operations). The scale was very vast (so the program would run into some efforts/ freeze), we will have to break it down into smaller chunks to iron out problems at smaller scales first I think.

Elements of the effort also appeared here on this forum:

Indian Military ORBAT and Wargaming

(Space Reserved)

defencehub.live

Which I will update again later (when the new effort is ongoing/completed) for benefit of interested members here.

Do you suppose you could get some well-endowed member to buy a copy of CMO so that we can get familiar with it?

 

[Nilgiri]

You forgot the Major, 'Panzerkiel'. A very good man, an officer and a gentleman.

yeah but I remember him staying out of the nitty gritties as it would be "unfair" heh....since we were doing the whole OPSEC arrangement in that effort too.

He was (iirc) supposed to be some arbiter, feedback guy after the first round of results that never quite materialised. He would be excellent to have on board in same capacity....or more if he prefers.

Anyway I'll show up wherever Oscar is and contribute to best of my ability, wherever the new effort shapes up and establishes.

 

[Nilgiri]

Do you suppose you could get some well-endowed member to buy a copy of CMO so that we can get familiar with it?

I think @hellfire2006 already has it.

If not I will acquire it. We can start a few forays already in the wargaming thread here to practice things out. Ill be busy advent, christmas, new years etc...but then yes after that I'm ready to reinvigorate where I can on this.

 

[Afif]

I believe the thread will expire along with the original forum. I would expect the main guy (Oscar) will have saved the work done to bring it out again when the next effort gains muster.

Have to see where Oscar settles and establishes now. Then the Pak side had strong interested members like Joe mentions with Desert Fox, Signalian, Gryphon and a couple others.



Yes he was hellfire in the wargame, joined PDF around that same time I think.

We should start with smaller test engagements that can mimic some variety of skirmishes (concerning each branch) this time before we scale into bigger things.



It was an effort to simulate a conventional war between India and Pakistan in CMO (Command modern operations). The scale was very vast (so the program would run into some efforts/ freeze), we will have to break it down into smaller chunks to iron out problems at smaller scales first I think.

Elements of the effort also appeared here on this forum:

Indian Military ORBAT and Wargaming

(Space Reserved)

defencehub.live

Which I will update again later (when the new effort is ongoing/completed) for benefit of interested members here.

Finally, if @Joe Shearer only said it was CMO it would have been enough. I thought it was totally something new. I have a crack file. Used it to do tiny unrealistic skirmishes few. Always wanted to do something big. But never got the chance. Instead, spent most of the free time reading US Army's ATPs.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I think @hellfire2006 already has it.

If not I will acquire it. We can start a few forays already in the wargaming thread here to practice things out. Ill be busy advent, christmas, new years etc...but then yes after that I'm ready to reinvigorate where I can on this.

I had in mind small exercises to test out contests that would fit into a jig-saw puzzle when considering the grand outline. Obviously can't name them here.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Finally, if @Joe Shearer only said it was CMO it would have been enough. I thought it was totally something new. I have a crack file. Used it to do tiny unrealistic skirmishes few. Always wanted to do something big. But never got the chance. Instead, spent most of the free time reading US Army's ATPs.

So here is our chance. What are you waiting for?

You will have to sign an oath of loyalty, of course!

 

[Afif]

So here is our chance. What are you waiting for?

You will have to sign an oath of loyalty, of course!

 

[Joe Shearer]

View attachment 64023

নির্বাক!

 

[Afif]

No, seriously. I will sit down in front of the PC tomorrow. Let’s see….need to familiarise myself with deeper functions and unexplored options first. Mastering all CMO functions will take some time. It is such a vast and comprehensive simulation to dive in. I mean, no wonder professionals and armed force use it for wargaming.

My knowledge in Land warfare doctrines, tactics, techniques and procedures is not bad. (I would say) But fairly basic in Air & space domain. And probably primitive in naval warfare.