Live Conflict Israel-Palestine War|Regional Escalations

[Kartal1]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1821630590258405603

 

[Kartal1]

New and interesting details on the Biden administration's last-ditch effort to reach a Gaza hostage and ceasefire deal:

A senior U.S. official told reporters that the decision to publish the joint statement and convene the summit next week was the result of the phone calls President Biden had on Tuesday with the Emir of Qatar and the President of Egypt. The U.S. official said that convening a summit was a proposal of the Egyptians and Qataris and President Biden supported it

The U.S. official said that before the summit on Thursday, there will be preparatory talks by teams from all sides to lay the ground

"On Thursday the negotiations will be resumed. We do not expect to reach an agreement on Thursday. This is a beginning and not an end. There is an urgency to get this process back on track," the U.S. official said

The U.S. official noted that gaps remain in four or five issues related to the implementation of the hostage and ceasefire deal and that both sides have tough positions on these issues

He stressed that if by Thursday there is no closing of gaps between Israel and Hamas and if the U.S., Egypt and Qatar think it could help - they might present a bridging proposal to close the gaps

“The gaps that remain are bridgeable and we don't have time to lose,” the U.S. official said. "We had deep discussions with the Israelis this week. We think there is a way forward. Israel and Hamas will have to make decisions. Most of the work has been done and the deal is on the table - and it is possible to get a deal. There are lives on the line”.

The U.S. official said that the invitation to the summit is not directly related to the regional tensions with Iran and Hezbollah and emphasized that it is necessary to reach a deal for the release of hostages and a ceasefire in Gaza regardless

"But Iran has publicly stated that if there is a ceasefire in Gaza it may affect its position. If they start on a major war in the Middle East and launch an attack on Israel, it will jeopardize any chance of achieving a ceasefire in Gaza”, the U.S. official said

He further emphasized that there is no legitimate basis for Iran to launch a military attack against Israel. "The consequences of such an attack would be serious for Iran and its economy," the U.S. official said

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1821680861575590101

 

[Fuzuli NL]

 

[Bogeyman]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1821717113800929791

Are those here who treat Hamas as rapists based on questionable images? You see that, right? Israeli terrorists want rape to be used as a weapon of war. And they say this without hesitation or shame in front of anyone. So stop drawing conclusions based on absurd images. And pay attention to this cruelty of the terrorists. Condemning "both sides" will only lead you to insult those who resist the cruelty of the oppressors. Stop showing us the filth that Israel reveals through its ability to manipulate and create perceptions through social media and through the journalists it buys with money!! Stop giving credit to Israel's statements anymore!!

 

[Relic]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1821717113800929791

Are those here who treat Hamas as rapists based on questionable images? You see that, right? Israeli terrorists want rape to be used as a weapon of war. And they say this without hesitation or shame in front of anyone. So stop drawing conclusions based on absurd images. And pay attention to this cruelty of the terrorists. Condemning "both sides" will only lead you to insult those who resist the cruelty of the oppressors. Stop showing us the filth that Israel reveals through its ability to manipulate and create perceptions through social media and through the journalists it buys with money!! Stop giving credit to Israel's statements anymore!!

There are people who rape, murder, commit acts of cowardice and war crimes in every country, region, culture, race, religion, military group, etc... Those acts are not unique to any one group and there are no groups immune to those actions from individuals.

Since the beginning of conflict there have been acts considered to be "out of bounds" relative to the time in question, perpetrated against people and it is seemingly always the goal in a conflict to paint one's advisary as uniquely barbaric and cruel.

The reality is that while the "both sides" narrative doesn't satiate our conviction that the opponent is uniquely immoral, "both sides" is often the actual answer... Maybe it looks different, or it happens in a different way, or at a different rate, but it's objectively true that in war both sides do pretty shitty things to each other.

IMO, if we can accept that reality, there are far more substantive conversations to be had... I've said 1000 times before and I'll say it again. You can't end war crimes or heinous acts of malice by legislation alone. There are a certain segment of every population, every organization and every community that will not comply with the established rules and will act they desire.

The Nazis did unspeakable things to various populations in Eastern Europe. I think those actions are well documented. That said, Canadian, American and British troops did some objectively deplorable things to many of those German soldiers after D-Day and the push towards Germany. Many of those stories are barely known, shrouded in the pages of history, overshadowed by the actions of the Germans. Below is an example.

Canadian hunters and trappers were welcomed into special operations regiments as scouts. These men had unique skill sets that enabled them to go off into the woods by themselves at night and scout enemy locations, undetected... But that's not all they did. Some of them hunted German soldiers like animals. They'd sneak into camps at night and slit the the throats of sleeping Germans. They'd light the tents on fire of sleeping German soldiers and burn them alive as they slept. Any that tried to flee from the fire of the tent would be shot and killed. These scouts were often not believed by their chains of command, who thought they were embelishing their actions in the night. As a result, they started desecrating the German soldiers that they hunted, cutting off fingers and ears, removing teeth, etc as proof of bounty. There were numerous anecdotal accounts of psychological and physical torture so inhumane that chains of command simply turned a blind eye so as not to have to investigate it... One "practice" included forcing German POWs to eat each other's feces, simply for amusement and to disgrace them. SS members were often stripped down and tied up. Another captive member from their unit would then be forced, at gunpoint, to beat his friend / countryman to death with a blunt object, in front of other terrified POWs. The process was repeated with various members of the unit until none were left, at which point they'd simply shoot the last man remaining so that none of them were spared.

Horrific truths of war.

 

[GraveDigger388]

There are people who rape, murder, commit acts of cowardice and war crimes in every country, region, culture, race, religion, military group, etc... Those acts are not unique to any one group and there are no groups immune to those actions from individuals.

Since the beginning of conflict there have been acts considered to be "out of bounds" relative to the time in question, perpetrated against people and it is seemingly always the goal in a conflict to paint one's advisary as uniquely barbaric and cruel.

The reality is that while the "both sides" narrative doesn't satiate our conviction that the opponent is uniquely immoral, "both sides" is often the actual answer... Maybe it looks different, or it happens in a different way, or at a different rate, but it's objectively true that in war both sides do pretty shitty things to each other.

IMO, if we can accept that reality, there are far more substantive conversations to be had... I've said 1000 times before and I'll say it again. You can't end war crimes or heinous acts of malice by legislation alone. There are a certain segment of every population, every organization and every community that will not comply with the established rules and will act they desire.

MF the thing is only in Israel do you see the fucking populace rally behind those atrocities in BROAD DAYLIGHT!! And then they have other parties like YOU constantly trying to smoothen the implication.

For fuck's sake I've had it with this forum.

 

[Relic]

MF the thing is only in Israel do you see the fucking populace rally behind those atrocities in BROAD DAYLIGHT!! And then they have other parties like YOU constantly trying to smoothen the implication.

For fuck's sake I've had it with this forum.

That's objectively not true. They partied in the streets of Gaza in BROAD DAYLIGHT when members of HAMAS returned from Israel with men, women and children as hostages that were meant to be used as bargaining chips in war. A deplorable act that we have video footage of hundreds (if not thousands) of people in Gaza cheering on as if kidnapping civilians is a righteous act... Although I'm sure you'll find a way to morally defend that act, while condeming Israel. For the record, the Israelis that raped people and those who support them should be absolutely held to account, but so to should be the people who kidnapped civilians and the those that cheered it on.

Rape is a deplorable act. So is kidnapping non-combatants. I'm highly consistent in both directions.

Stop the moral grandstanding. This isn't a "one side are saints and the other side are demons" type scenario.

 

[Relic]

Israel continues to be effective from the air using both conventional aviation and drones.

In this video they use either Hellfire or APKWS (Hydra-70) rockets to hunt HAMAS in Jenin.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/1elmz1f
In this video an air launched weapon (likely a JDAM) is used to destroy an ammunition storage site used by Hezbollah.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/1elmutg
In this video Israel claims to kill a commander of the Redwan Force (part of Hezbollah). They use what looks like a hellfire rocket launched from drone.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/1ekwrvt

 

[Relic]

Hezbollah operatives being hunted from the air by Israeli drones. Locations unknown.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/1ekg19x

 

[GraveDigger388]

Rape is a deplorable act. So is kidnapping non-combatants. I'm highly consistent in both directions.

I agree. Then Israel are guilty of both of those. In a grander scale.

 

[Relic]

USA Navy has sent 12 F-18 Super Hornets from Strike Fighter Squadron 25 of the USS Roosevelt to an undisclosed base in the Middle East, from which they can support Israel if tensions erupt. Along with the F-18s is an E-2D Hawkeye AWACS aircraft and an E-2D Hawkeye refueling aircraft.

USA Air Force has sent 12 F-22 Raptors to the same undisclosed base in the Middle East, from Elemendorf Air Force Base in Alaska. The 12 Air superiority fighters arrived in the Middle East on Thursday.

24 highly capable aircraft, with AWACS and refueling support, for the U.S. to add to the fight should Israel and Iran not be able to settle things diplomatically and the Israel / Hezbollah front explodes into conflict.

US fighter jets reach Middle East armed with warning for Iran

The U.S. Navy and U.S. Air Force are sending fighter jets to the Middle East amid tensions between Iran and Israel.

www.newsweek.com

 

[Relic]

I agree. Then Israel are guilty of both of those. In a grander scale.

Nobody (at least in this thread) is refuting Israel's participation in deplorable acts. They're not some uniquely benevolent nation that does everything the "right way". They've got bad actors in their country, as do we all.

This weird game of trying to paint the Israelis and / or the Palestinians as uniquely evil is both childish and unproductive. This conflict needs a permanent diplomatic solution that cannot be achieved as long as both sides (supported by their respective outside interests) paint each other as uniquely evil animals. It's impossible to come to a reasonable outcome for both parties when both sides are busy trying to win the propaganda war, instead of getting serious about coming up with palatable terms for a permanent ceasefire and a path towards a two state solution that makes sense (likely through land swaps).