Morocco Moroccan Armed Forces

Knowledgeseeker

Experienced member
Moderator
Arab Moderator
Morocco Moderator
Messages
1,711
Reactions
16 4,383
Nation of residence
Norway
Nation of origin
Moroco
Su 57 is still not near Block 70.

SU 57 is a prototype unlike F16 that is a finished Jet
Only a handfull have been tested , and it still to early to tell. The f16 have thousand of hours in Service. The viper version is equiped with Aesa radars, and we all know how the russians are operating in Ukraina. Russia is far behind the western world when it comes to avionics, and radar.
 

Chakib larbi

Contributor
Moderator
Arab Moderator
Algeria Moderator
Messages
1,048
Reactions
4 2,866
Nation of residence
Algeria
Nation of origin
Algeria
I see alot of empty words from you, and false statements. I will not go into the financial aspect of the millitary funding because you mentioned that algeria is superior millitary wise so i will stay within the conversation. Dont let us talk about everything else, but yes the VL mica deal is ordered by loan from BNP.

Anyway back to the main point! The 48 F16 block 72+ Viper, and the 26 mirage that are configured to MF2000 are more then enough for the algerian air force with their old mig 29, and SU 30. Like you know yourself most of the jets dont even have targeting pods, and we know very well from previous wars how the russian jets fail to deliever against wester technology. If you take a look at how russian air force is operating in ukraina you would see how they lack targeting pods while using Compass.

You mentioned the following " The rest of the deals you're talking about whether it was sep v3 / barak / these are just posts on Twitter and some military websites".
The barak mx deal is a new deal, and i dont have any dates to provide for you. However you wrong when it comes to the sepv3 abraham tank, it got actually ordered in 2017 when it got introduced to the us army, and is rumoured to be delievered from this year.

I feel like this is a wrong thread to discuss this capabilites between the 2 countries, are you up for a new thread?
It is good that you admit that the Mica deal was financed by French banks and the same goes for the rest of the deals Which are financed either by French loans or Gulf donations ....But the most important thing is, will these countries continue to fund your logistical capabilities? Regarding ammunition, maintenance and operating costs..The answer is clear, the Moroccan army, in most of its exercises, does not use live ammunition...
But okay, we will stop discussing logistics and financial matters and move on to discussing technical matters But before that, as I told you There is no deal for sep v3 Just talk on the net, as is the same case for the Orizzonte or Himars But there is no statement from the American side about these deals.. so stop chasing illusions...

Back to the Topic

First of all Are you going to chase and shoot down a plane? with your disgnation pod or with your Radar and Irst Systems ......except the block 72+ None of your plane Possesses a radar with the same efficiency and capabilities as the Hybrid Bars N011M Pesa radar on the Su-30 MKI (A) ... for now all of Your planes are still using the old MSA type radars which is very weak and vulnerable in facing Algerian electronic warfare capabilities/assets both in air and land..beside that afaik moroccan army have no capabilities in EW warfare.

The other thing the MiG-29 S fighters of Algerian Air Force are in the phase of decommissioning and they are being replaced by more advanced Mig-29 M2 fighters who outperforms any air fighter currently in Morocco And it will be in the same level with the block 72+ when it get it AESA radar..
But the most important thing for Mig-29 M2 that He brought a new arsenal of weaponry to the algerian inventory like the KH-38 Family of modular missiles and the tactical anti-ship missile Kh-35UE and the RVV-SD Air-to-air missile and the T220/E targeting pod so now we do have a disgnator pod so u can be happy ..

Back to the issue of targeting pod within the Algerian Air Force ..yes until the arrival of the MiG 29 M2 We didn't Operate any disgnation pod but This doesn't mean that we lack of guided weapons ..In fact, we even operate a long range ALCM of the KH-59 Family which was recently supported by the Kh-35UE dual-role cruise anti-ship land-attack missile...AFAIK no cruise capabilities yet in morrocan inventory...

In the end, the failure of the Russian army in Ukraine is due to the failure of Russian tactics - Lack of the concept of combined arms - Lack of extensive use of precision weapons due to high costs - lack of use of intelligence-gathering capability and nothing to do with the quality of their weapos in fact ...And besides all this ,The time of decision to go to war in Ukraine was a strategic mistake and the Russians must now confront the continuing flow of Western weapons into Ukraine Which makes the conflict in Ukraine now more like an endless war ..

But the Algerian-Moroccan conflict is not at all similar to the Ukrainian-Russian global conflict, and It is closer to the Armenian-Azeri conflict .... but be aware We are not the Armenian state..
As I told you earlier In a possible conflict between us, the Moroccan Air Force should first deal with the Algerian anti-access/area denial (A2AD) Which consists of the most advanced Russian and Chinese air defense systems And a full scale integrated network of Russian, Chinese and American medium and long-range radars ,which are operated by Russian and American C4ISR /C5I command and control systems,and supported by huge electronic warfare assets....
 
Last edited:

Chakib larbi

Contributor
Moderator
Arab Moderator
Algeria Moderator
Messages
1,048
Reactions
4 2,866
Nation of residence
Algeria
Nation of origin
Algeria
Su 57 is still not near Block 70.

SU 57 is a prototype unlike F16 that is a finished Jet
Not even closer...But maybe in US AIR FORCE hands in a fully networked environment supported by AWACS /ISTAR aircraft, an F-16 Viper could have an advantage against the Su-57.. but not in a potential North African conflict.

Anyway the Su-57 is no longer a prototype It was field-tested by VKS for days in Ukraine in real combat operations and its export agreement was signed with Algeria in 2019 along the MiG-29 M and Su-34 deal, and by 2023, Algeria will start receiving its first Su-34s and the Su-57s by the year of 2025 ...
 
M

Manomed

Guest
Not even closer...But maybe in US AIR FORCE hands in a fully networked environment supported by AWACS /ISTAR aircraft, an F-16 Viper could have an advantage against the Su-57.. but not in a potential North African conflict.

Anyway the Su-57 is no longer a prototype It was field-tested by VKS for days in Ukraine in real combat operations and its export agreement was signed with Algeria in 2019 along the MiG-29 M and Su-34 deal, and by 2023, Algeria will start receiving its first Su-34s and the Su-57s by the year of 2025 ...
fielded without a radar comparable to anything western tech has.
 

Chakib larbi

Contributor
Moderator
Arab Moderator
Algeria Moderator
Messages
1,048
Reactions
4 2,866
Nation of residence
Algeria
Nation of origin
Algeria
fielded without a radar comparable to anything western tech has.
Are you serious...the Su-57 is equipped with N036 Byelka AESA radar as part of Sh121MIRES system which also contains a set of AESA radars on the sides of the fuselage and on the wing's leading edge, for electronic warfare purposes and iff role
 

Knowledgeseeker

Experienced member
Moderator
Arab Moderator
Morocco Moderator
Messages
1,711
Reactions
16 4,383
Nation of residence
Norway
Nation of origin
Moroco
It is good that you admit that the Mica deal was financed by French banks and the same goes for the rest of the deals Which are financed either by French loans or Gulf donations ....But the most important thing is, will these countries continue to fund your logistical capabilities? Regarding ammunition, maintenance and operating costs..The answer is clear, the Moroccan army, in most of its exercises, does not use live ammunition...
But okay, we will stop discussing logistics and financial matters and move on to discussing technical matters But before that, as I told you There is no deal for sep v3 Just talk on the net, as is the same case for the Orizzonte or Himars But there is no statement from the American side about these deals.. so stop chasing illusions...

Back to the Topic

First of all Are you going to chase and shoot down a plane? with your disgnation pod or with your Radar and Irst Systems ......except the block 72+ None of your plane Possesses a radar with the same efficiency and capabilities as the Hybrid Bars N011M Pesa radar on the Su-30 MKI (A) ... for now all of Your planes are still using the old MSA type radars which is very weak and vulnerable in facing Algerian electronic warfare capabilities/assets both in air and land..beside that afaik moroccan army have no capabilities in EW warfare.

The other thing the MiG-29 S fighters of Algerian Air Force are in the phase of decommissioning and they are being replaced by more advanced Mig-29 M2 fighters who outperforms any air fighter currently in Morocco And it will be in the same level with the block 72+ when it get it AESA radar..
But the most important thing for Mig-29 M2 that He brought a new arsenal of weaponry to the algerian inventory like the KH-38 Family of modular missiles and the tactical anti-ship missile Kh-35UE and the RVV-SD Air-to-air missile and the T220/E targeting pod so now we do have a disgnator pod so u can be happy ..

Back to the issue of targeting pod within the Algerian Air Force ..yes until the arrival of the MiG 29 M2 We didn't Operate any disgnation pod but This doesn't mean that we lack of guided weapons ..In fact, we even operate a long range ALCM of the KH-59 Family which was recently supported by the Kh-35UE dual-role cruise anti-ship land-attack missile...AFAIK no cruise capabilities yet in morrocan inventory...

In the end, the failure of the Russian army in Ukraine is due to the failure of Russian tactics - Lack of the concept of combined arms - Lack of extensive use of precision weapons due to high costs - lack of use of intelligence-gathering capability and nothing to do with the quality of their weapos in fact ...And besides all this ,The time of decision to go to war in Ukraine was a strategic mistake and the Russians must now confront the continuing flow of Western weapons into Ukraine Which makes the conflict in Ukraine now more like an endless war ..

But the Algerian-Moroccan conflict is not at all similar to the Ukrainian-Russian global conflict, and It is closer to the Armenian-Azeri conflict .... but be aware We are not the Armenian state..
As I told you earlier In a possible conflict between us, the Moroccan Air Force should first deal with the Algerian anti-access/area denial (A2AD) Which consists of the most advanced Russian and Chinese air defense systems And a full scale integrated network of Russian, Chinese and American medium and long-range radars ,which are operated by Russian and American C4ISR /C5I command and control systems,and supported by huge electronic warfare assets....




You mentioned " the same goes for the rest of the deals Which are financed either by French loans or Gulf donations". I call that only cheap talk, or pure propaganda. Most of the deals are not donations or loans! Morocco does use live ammuniton in it exercises, just follow this thread i will post more videos from the african lion exercise taking place now. Yes lets stop discussing the financial matter of the weapons. I never mentioned morocco acquiring himars, tell me where i mentioned himars?????.

However i mentioned M1 abraham sep V3 deal! You say that this is just illusions, and "twitter" talk. You can take a look into this thread: https://defencehub.live/threads/morocco-to-upgrade-abrams-tanks.1836/. The completion date of the delievery is estimated to be completed March 31, 2022. Please just dont talk about things you dont have knowledge about, or atleast dobbel check on the internet before making a empty statement.


You claim that none of the planes posses the same capabalities as the NO11M pesa radar on the algerian SU-30. You realise that morocco will recieve 24 vipers ( 12 Already delievered), and the rest are getting modernized? Those who are not modernized right now at the moment we speak have the APG-68 radar. Do you really make a claim that the NO11M are better then APG-68? Yes morocco lacks electronic warfdare system but dont forget that the Moroccan f16 are also equiped with AIDEWS. Its also reported that morocco will recieve the koral from turkey, but i guess you will call it twitter post. ( Source: TRT ARABI).

Come on bro i cant believe im reading this! Mig-29 M2 better then the Vipers???


I agree with your words when it comes to the ukrainan war except that you mentioned that the war has " Nothing to do with the quality of the weapons". Offcoursae the quality playes a huge role. Thats where i feel you are making big mistakes when comparing the technolgy between the west and the russians. Except that i totally agree with many points you made.


You mentioned now that a conflict between Morocco, and algeria is closer to Armenia-Azeri war, and yes at this moment i do agree! But why did you mention earlier
" Morocco is not a match for Algeria, and it will never be like that". Please think twice before making a statement. I never said that algeria is no match for morocco, or that we are superior in every field. I only mentioned that the moroccan air force will have a edge with the vipers, and the new procurments!


I will create the thread now! i will copy and paste what i wrote into the new thread. You can give a response there.
 

Chakib larbi

Contributor
Moderator
Arab Moderator
Algeria Moderator
Messages
1,048
Reactions
4 2,866
Nation of residence
Algeria
Nation of origin
Algeria
1656275464875.png
287301274_1060427201232473_5925443529623058337_n.jpg
 

Follow us on social media

Top Bottom