• Forum restore complete (see latest announcement thread)

TR Propulsion Systems

boredaf

Experienced member
Messages
2,271
Solutions
1
Reactions
42 6,661
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
So final stage of building the first proptotype
I hope it is ignited as soon as humanly possible because we really need this engine. It'll take a year or two of testing it on the ground before it can even start flying test in a drone (iirc what TEI's CEO said before) then there will be even more testing.
 

IC3M@N FX

Contributor
Messages
701
Reactions
3 30 1,432
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
I don't believe in anything until I hear it from his own mouth from Professor Doctor Mahmut Faruk Akşit.
 

Fairon

Contributor
Messages
511
Reactions
6 1,278
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
In the final stage of what?

Srsly, the CEO of TEI, TAI etc. needs to work on their communication. recently they really undermined themselves and their companies...

Tbh I find his honesty and realistic timeframes refreshing. He is not selling dreams, always notifies when something went wrong.(like additional delays because of problems with acquiring some foreign subcomponents) and always gives realistic timeframes.

Yes sometimes it is not the things we like to hear but he tells the situations as is.
 

what

Experienced member
Moderator
Messages
2,365
Reactions
17 6,976
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
In the final stage of what?

Srsly, the CEO of TEI, TAI etc. needs to work on their communication. recently they really undermined themselves and their companies...

Generally speaking, we shouldn't judge statements by twitter accounts that badly try to summarize what they said in 3 bullet points. Neither should we take them (the twitter accounts) serious, its better to look for the original source and post the entire context.

I have yet to to find the original source.
 

Rodeo

Contributor
DefenceHub Diplomat
Messages
1,330
Reactions
31 5,069
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
I guess by raw part numbers done (40+ apparently)? Brochure:


Revenue wise (TEI) its decent start and progress but a long way to go:


Is there annual report sheet to compare capital, assets (capex) vs opex vis a vis GE for example?

GE has 75 billion revenue yearly and about double that for market cap.

I can't find market cap for TEI. I guess because its JV between TAI and GE. TAI has yearly revenue around 2 - 3 billion USD now it seems....but no market cap I think since its not publicly listed?

In the larger sense for all of this, Turkish economic fundamentals have to be secured and made resilient in mid to long term....to give better valuations and investment flows. But this has been less than ideal.
According to Mahmut Aksit, their(TEI) export figure was $345 million dollars last year and they want to increase it to $445 million dollars for 2024.

 

Rodeo

Contributor
DefenceHub Diplomat
Messages
1,330
Reactions
31 5,069
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
It doesn't look finished

1702993564_web6000.jpg


 

TheInsider

Experienced member
Professional
Messages
4,894
Solutions
1
Reactions
51 17,040
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
This is %100 TEI and the engine is ready for action. All of the sensor cables are in place. I don't know if this is a recent photo.
 

Nilgiri

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Aviation Specialist
Messages
11,083
Reactions
153 22,638
Nation of residence
Canada
Nation of origin
India
Might even be an old photo.

@Nilgiri does this look like ready for first firing?


It looks ready to me from first impression.

The 2nd picture is with the accessory drive/gearbox (and fuel pumps, lines etc) so that is how it would look for when you mount it on aircraft that has these needs from/to the engine. Aircraft-engine interface stuff you can say.

Those are not required for core alone in a test cell....you are still providing fuel, lubricating oil etc separately with own umbilicals.
 

DBdev

Well-known member
Messages
308
Reactions
8 540
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
@Nilgiri You are the engine expert here. Will any of these hypersonic 6th gen jet engines become reality?

Some designs here seem simple enough that I feel like we are at the edge of global hypersonic travel era.
Considering all air travel is STILL subsonic with pentagon investing in Darkhorse, NGAD etc. a giant leap to Mach 10+ seems both sci-fi and reality.

 

Oublious

Experienced member
The Netherlands Correspondent
Messages
2,780
Reactions
15 6,101
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey

TEI is plannin to ignite Tf6000 fist quarter of 2024, he is talking about other engines maturing, upgrading en certification.
 

Nilgiri

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Aviation Specialist
Messages
11,083
Reactions
153 22,638
Nation of residence
Canada
Nation of origin
India
@Nilgiri You are the engine expert here. Will any of these hypersonic 6th gen jet engines become reality?

Some designs here seem simple enough that I feel like we are at the edge of global hypersonic travel era.
Considering all air travel is STILL subsonic with pentagon investing in Darkhorse, NGAD etc. a giant leap to Mach 10+ seems both sci-fi and reality.


Very high chance they will be become reality. Just matter of time.

Hypersonic is no real huge change from supersonic regime (compared to subsonic to supersonic) in lot of fundamental physics involved etc.

It is basically diminishing returns on the same set of issues supersonic faces.

Much higher computation power available now will brute force solve lot of issues in the coming years.....these were simply not available in the era from say 1950 - 2000 (which have huge inertia in the capital technology still out there and the also important efforts of making them better etc).

But for this chunk of 50 years and next chunk of 50 years this century, the computation and AI power will be huge catalysts.
 

uçuyorum

Contributor
Messages
1,225
Reactions
15 1,988
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
ChatGPT:

Technically, developing a bigger turbofan engine out of a smaller one is not a simple task and goes beyond just "enlarging" the parts. The process requires complex engineering, design, and testing.

Firstly, turbofan engines are complex machinery built to very precise specifications, and their performance depends heavily on their design and dimensions. A small increase in size could greatly affect their operation, possibly leading to decreased efficiency, overheating, or mechanical failure.

Secondly, the materials used in turbofan engines are chosen for their specific properties at particular sizes. If you were to simply scale up every part of the engine, these materials may not have the desired properties at the larger size. The strength, weight, and heat-resistance of the materials could all change in ways that are difficult to predict.

Lastly, many aspects of the engine's operation, such as the flow of air and fuel, the combustion process, and the way the engine is cooled, would all change if the engine were scaled up. These changes would require complex adjustments to the engine's design and operation.

In conclusion, while it is theoretically possible, it would require extensive research, development, and testing which could be very time-consuming and costly. You would almost be building a new engine from scratch, rather than "developing" a bigger engine out of a smaller one. Thus, it would be better to either modify the existing engine to increase its efficiency and power output or design a new larger engine from the ground up.

------------------------------------------------------------

So this means that TF-35000 will be very likely not based on TF-6000.
TF-6000 is only seen as a step towards TF-35000 by TEI.
TRMOTOR is working on TF-35000 for several years now.
Are you saying that the engineers at TRMOTOR have no know-how?
A company does not just work by cumulation of engineers CVs sadly. Actual project experience is everything for a team to become truly productive. You can take this statement for every engineering project.

For TF6000 i specifically said tech demonstrator and not ptototype.
 

Spitfire9

Contributor
Think Tank Analyst
Messages
1,272
Reactions
17 1,665
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
United Kingdom
ChatGPT:

Technically, developing a bigger turbofan engine out of a smaller one is not a simple task and goes beyond just "enlarging" the parts. The process requires complex engineering, design, and testing.

Firstly, turbofan engines are complex machinery built to very precise specifications, and their performance depends heavily on their design and dimensions. A small increase in size could greatly affect their operation, possibly leading to decreased efficiency, overheating, or mechanical failure.

Secondly, the materials used in turbofan engines are chosen for their specific properties at particular sizes. If you were to simply scale up every part of the engine, these materials may not have the desired properties at the larger size. The strength, weight, and heat-resistance of the materials could all change in ways that are difficult to predict.

Lastly, many aspects of the engine's operation, such as the flow of air and fuel, the combustion process, and the way the engine is cooled, would all change if the engine were scaled up. These changes would require complex adjustments to the engine's design and operation.

In conclusion, while it is theoretically possible, it would require extensive research, development, and testing which could be very time-consuming and costly. You would almost be building a new engine from scratch, rather than "developing" a bigger engine out of a smaller one. Thus, it would be better to either modify the existing engine to increase its efficiency and power output or design a new larger engine from the ground up.

------------------------------------------------------------

So this means that TF-35000 will be very likely not based on TF-6000.
TF-6000 is only seen as a step towards TF-35000 by TEI.
TRMOTOR is working on TF-35000 for several years now.
Are you saying that the engineers at TRMOTOR have no know-how?

Given what is written above, is this report likely to be accurate?

Türkiye's top engine manufacturer on Tuesday said a unit that will power the nation's first domestically developed fighter jet is almost ready, in what will mark the industry's latest advancement in a homegrown drive to curb external dependency on critical equipment.

 
Last edited:

Spitfire9

Contributor
Think Tank Analyst
Messages
1,272
Reactions
17 1,665
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
United Kingdom
"The TF10000, envisaged to produce 6,000 lbf of thrust and power many manned and unmanned aviation platforms, including KAAN, is almost complete, Akşit said."

TF10000 has nothing to do with KAAN.

Understood. Inaccurate reporting.

Are there any signs that TR6000 is nearing its first run?
 
Top Bottom