TR Propulsion Systems

[No Name]

Did Azra enter mass production yet? if i'm remember correctly it was planned to enter praduction some time this year.

 

[Kartal1]

The Hybrid solution is very impressive, and when I look at the numbers it should be a no brainer. There are however somethings that only the wise know from experience, so I assume that may be why we haven't swapped to Hybrid solution.

But I don't see why they can't have several prototypes and test them thoroughly while still acquiring some standard conventional ones.

I know that diversifying is more expensive for us, but it is necessary to be able to change mindset as well.

I think this could be an example of one of those old doctrins that needs to be challenged and changed or at least battlefield tested @Kartal1

I am also on the opinion that it will be good to explore the option. It's just that I am not so confident in MKE making it work as intended.

 

[Nilgiri]

F404 and F414 are the epitome of how military turbine engines can be made to be reliable.

The F404 has a version called F412 with a very large inlet fan. This is a non afterburning engine specifically made for A-12 Avenger 2 plane. This engine developed very high thrust due to the large fan it utilised. In F414, they used a similar but comparatively smaller fan than the one used in F412 but larger than the one in F404. This fan provided a lot of air to flow through the compression and combustion section. To accommodate this extra air flow and sustain efficient burn, accordingly, they had to enlarge the diameter of the f412’s and F414’s combustion chambers. This way they were able to achieve 13000lbf dry thrust from the f414 which had essentially the same dimensions as f404, apart from the larger fan and bigger combustor. This was called a “trapped vortex combustor”.

A-12 Avenger 2
View attachment 69491
Whence the A-12 project was cancelled so was F412 engine. But it paved the way for f414.

With the EDE (Enhanced DurabilityEngine) version, F414 has gone through an upgrade of materials and aerodynamic design in it’s HP Turbine stage, allowing it to go hotter without problems and by reducing HP compressor stage by one from 7 to 6 it was made possible to lower SFC and improve durability by 3 times.

The EPE (Enhanced Performance Engine) version of F414 has been furnished with a totally new Fan, Core and Turbine section that gave a 20% increase to thrust level, achieving 26400lbf with AB.

GE has also been conducting experiments on F414, successfully, by replacing LP turbines with CMC materials.

I only hope that at TEI, our engineers, being part of GE family, are making note of these innovations and will in time, apply them to our own engines too.

Love your posts

A-12 takes me back to old times with other buddies, we used to chat about it all the time.

Really genesis of GE arc here, is with the large Human resource acquiring and organisation done w.r.t the F110 program in the 1970s. How this intersects with the Pentagon analysis being done at the time regd program allocations/ecosystems regd the F-111 vs F-14 (there was an earlier synthesis of much larger carriers able to handle a near F-111 sized a/c before it diverged into F-14 to make use of conventional sized and existing allocated carriers etc).....that pratt could not be given in monolithic way (i.e whole point to bring GE huge capital to bear, though it was more civvy oriented to that point). But one will always notice the F-111 and F-14 are tied at hip in lot of things as result (this was argument given for TF-30 for F-14 originally).

But the GE arc investment was notably seen in 1980s with both the F-15/16 powerplant arcs and also TF30 being replaced by GE F110 as well.

This paid off in all kind of ways (versus pratt and also what you mention here with ease of transitioning 404 to 412 and 414) downstream to make GE a potent force in military turbojet/fan powerplants. Things go relatively tic tac toe given the earlier project expertise developed by the various teams.

 

[neosinan]

Hisar OPVs are using Türasaş V8 16 engines.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1819769428654838076

 

[Bogeyman]

Hisar OPVs are using Türsaş V8 16 engines.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1819769428654838076

"Originally developed by TÜRASAŞ, the 8V 160, 8-cylinder machine can produce 1200 horsepower. Specific fuel consumption is 2.20 liters per gram/kilowatt hour."

 

[Anmdt]

Hisar OPVs are using Türasaş V8 16 engines.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1819769428654838076

I can not make sure of this, some informations cover electric motors as being indigeneous but i haven't heard of Turasas supplying medium speed diesels for the project. Gensets for on-board electricity have been supplied by Isbir elektrik as per usual. Since MAN provided end to end solution for the whole propulsion system, i am also considering that the genset's driving the electric motors are also supplied by MAN.

The engines of Turasas have certification for commercial applications but also haven't heard of Turk Loydu certifying these engines for naval applications.

Hisar Class' installed power is also given wrong, you can not sum the power of two system connected by 'Or', that is what CODELOD do, it is either all diesels, or diesel electric.

 

[Strong AI]

Kale Arge General Manager Cüneyt Kenger stated, "While last year we had the capacity to produce 2 engines per week, now we can produce 7 engines per week."

Having taken significant steps towards becoming a "Center of Excellence for Gas Turbine Systems" and achieving 100% growth in the past year, Kale Arge is currently engaged in the mass production and delivery of KTJ-3200 turbojet engines, which were uniquely developed using entirely domestic resources, for the SOM Air-Launched Cruise Missile (ALCM, TÜBİTAK SAGE) and the ATMACA Anti-Ship Cruise Missile (ASCM, ROKETSAN).

The company has also developed the KTJ3700 TJ Engine with a thrust capacity of 3,700N for the KARA ATMACA Land-Based Cruise Missile (SLCM) developed for the Land Forces Command, and delivered the first engine for the initial test firing at the end of January. Another engine developed by Kale Arge, the KTJ-1750 Turbojet Engine with a thrust capacity of 1,750N, successfully performed in the first live test firing of the ÇAKIR Cruise Missile, launched from the AKINCI UAV in May 2023.

During the Farnborough International Airshow, we had a comprehensive interview with Kale Arge General Manager Cüneyt Kenger regarding the current status of the Kale Arge Tuzla Development and Test Center renovation and Altitude Test Setup capacity increase projects, which began last year, the major milestones planned for ongoing engine projects in 2024, as well as the company's targets and expectations for the export market and future engine roadmaps. You can read this exclusive interview in our upcoming issue.

Some brief notes from our interview with Kale Arge General Manager Cüneyt Kenger:

• "We are about to introduce our third engine, the KTJ-3700, into the inventory, which will be used in the KARA ATMACA Missile."
• "We have an ARAT engine project. It is progressing very successfully. It's a 40-month project. We do not expect any delays. We aim to complete it on the normal schedule."
• "There will be a test firing with the SOM (KTJ-3200 TJ Engine) very soon."
• "The new altitude tests with the ÇAKIR Missile (KTJ-1750 TJ Engine) will be completed around October/November."
• "The company has grown very quickly. In the last year, Kale Arge has grown by 100%. A year ago, we had 120 employees, and now we have 240. We've doubled in size. Out of these, 120 are R&D/Engineering personnel."
• "Last year, we had the capacity to produce 2 engines per week, but now we can produce 7 engines per week. This has tripled..."
• "Next year, you will likely hear about an export contract. There are official requests for price quotes right now. It's not just discussions anymore, it's beyond that."
• "We see a significant need for smaller engines, especially for drones. The difference with these engines compared to ours is that they require longer operational time and longer life."
• "We want to develop a turbofan engine. After making a turbofan, we might move on to small turbofan engines for business jets. This way, we will also make a transition to the civilian sector..."
• "Seeing 10 years ahead is not very difficult; it's not a long time, but we slowly want to transition to dual-use engines. Because as a company, it's not right to put all the eggs in one basket... There could be collaborations on turbofan engines for small civilian aircraft. When we talk about the civilian sector, its qualification and certification requirements are very different. Therefore, perhaps not alone, but through partnerships, we can start engine projects, turbofan projects, for use in the civilian sector."

Kale Arge Genel Müdürü Cüneyt KENGER, “Geçtiğimiz Sene Haftada 2 Motor Kapasitemiz Varken Şimdi Haftada 7 Motor Yapabiliyoruz.”

“Gaz Türbinli Sistemler için Mükemmeliyet Merkezi” olma yolunda önemli adımlar atan ve son bir yılda %100 büyüme kaydeden Kale Arge, halen SOM Havadan Atılan Seyir Füzesi (ALCM, TÜBİTAK SAGE) ve ATMACA Gemisavar Seyir Füzesi (ASCM, ROKETSAN) için tamamen yerli imkanlarla özgün olarak...

www.defenceturkey.com