TR TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

Zafer

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Looking at this from afar - with no allegiance to Turkiye, Hamas, Israel, Germany or the US - I rate the chances of Turkiye receiving F-16 or Typhoon as near zero, given what I hear Erdogan say in his speeches since Israel struck back after the October 7 Hamas attack. In my opinion it is now wishful thinking to imagine that either will be supplied.

Turkiye had better get on buying Russian, Chinese or Pakistani if it wants something before KAAN is available with a Turkish engine. The least objectionable choice to NATO would be Pakistani, I guess. How would JF-17 compare to F-4?
Isreal struck their own people first in response to Hamas move before they struck Muslims. There are some real people in the world that will not take events as they are portrayed by mainstream media. There is still a good chance the EF deal to come through. If not we are better off building on our own capabilities on fast track. We can go full steam with engine development and squeeze time to the maximum by starting every aspect of development without waiting for results from previous development steps. This way we can probably do 10 ears of work in just 4 years. This is wisfull thinking but is more likely to happen.
 
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Spitfire9

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Isreal struck their own people first in response to Hamas move before they struck Muslims. There are some real people in the world that will not take events as they are portrayed by mainstream media. There is still a good chance the EF deal to come through. If not we are better off building on our own capabilities on fast track. We can go full steam with engine development and squeeze time to the maximum by starting every aspect of development without waiting for results from previous development steps. This way we can probably do 10 ears of work in just 4 years. This is wisfull thinking but is more likely to happen.
I don't think there is any real chance of the current German administration approving Typhoon supplies to Turkiye. But, if I remember correctly, Germany has elections in a year or two. Perhaps that will change with a new administration. Perhaps Erdogan will succeed in turning the UK, Italy or Spain into countries refusing to allow export to Turkiye. He seems to be trying hard to do so.

If the next UK government (election due next year) is not centre-right as now but centre/centre-left, it may refuse to allow British content in Typhoon to be supplied to Turkiye (before Germany gets a new government). While many British people support the Palestinians, far more now that Israel is killing civilians in Gaza, they do not support Hamas, which also kills civilians.
 
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GoatsMilk

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Looking at this from afar - with no allegiance to Turkiye, Hamas, Israel, Germany or the US - I rate the chances of Turkiye receiving F-16 or Typhoon as near zero, given what I hear Erdogan say in his speeches since Israel struck back after the October 7 Hamas attack. In my opinion it is now wishful thinking to imagine that either will be supplied.

Turkiye had better get on buying Russian, Chinese or Pakistani if it wants something before KAAN is available with a Turkish engine. The least objectionable choice to NATO would be Pakistani, I guess. How would JF-17 compare to F-4?

They don't sell Turkiye weapons because they like us, if anything they are at war with us. I know if Turkiye armed and trained the IRA on the British border the english would perceive it as an act of war. This is what the USA is doing with the PKK. Let alone many europeans giving sanctuary to these terrorists.

They use weapons to manipulate our actions, to control what we do.

The danger with the westerners completely cutting Turkiye off is that you will force Turkiye directly into the camp of Russia, Iran and China. Isreal will find herself facing a Turkiye that sees her as direct enemy like iran. What a nightmare that would be for Isreal if Turkiye and Iran are pushed to become allies, what a nightmare it would be for american european games in the middle east. They would be swiftly kicked out. No one in the middle east will be able to oppose both nations working together.

This will also force Turkiye to increase her resistance to the PKK games in Syria, no more f'king around, nothing to lose now, no weapons to blackmail us with etc.

As for the millions of refugees, no point helping europe if their effectlively trying to bury us.

Never think the americans or shit heads in europe are doing us favours, they do according to what is in their interests first. Turn Turkiye into a complete enemy and the cost will be high for europe too simply due to geography.

This is why the americans/europeans use a give and take approach, the carrot and stick approach. Don't attack PKK, we give you f16, attack PKK we wont sell you F16 etc etc.

Now it was in Turkiyes interest to take a balanced approach, we failed completely under AK party. But don't think if they push us to the other side that there wont be big costs to the imperial nations in the region, there will be.

Had Turkiye took Russias side in Ukraine, i suspect the war would have ended quickly, Turkish arms to Russia instead of Ukraine and no closure of the black sea. If tomrrow Turkiye ended up on Russia and Irans side, eastern europe is gone.

Could you imagine you may even end up seeing Chinese bases in Turkiye.

Now none of this is good for Turkiye, but the point is there is potentially massive costs to the west to keep shitting on Turkiye. So they are going to keep playing their pressure game, hinder us as much as possible but never cut us off so much that we turn the other way. They need a passive Turkiye for at least another 20 years to get their pkkistan in syria.

Because if tomorrow erdogan makes a deal with Assad, that game is over in Syria. Assad, Iran, Turkey and Russia will all make sure America leaves for good.

And on a side note the anglo-american world plays the good cop bad cop routine. If america is bad cop britain will play good cop, their agenda is completely aligned.
 
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MADDOG

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Screenshot 2023-11-19 at 10.52.59.png


Load tests, which have been ongoing for a while for Turkey's most important technology development project KAAN, have been completed. The mission systems and subsystems that will take place on KAAN, which was disassembled down to the smallest piece, began to take their place on the aircraft after independent tests for the maiden flight. This assembly activity will end with the engines taking their place in the prototype. KAAN, which will take to the runway after the assembly activity, will prepare for its first flight by completing its slow and high speed taxi tests. It is aimed that these activities will intensify in mid-December and KAAN will make its first flight on December 27.



The paint has reportedly been stripped off. The maiden flight will occur with primer colors.

Via https://www.aa.com.tr/tr/savunma-sa...hazir-kaan-ilk-ucus-icin-son-montajda/3065767
 
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View attachment 63311

Load tests, which have been ongoing for a while for Turkey's most important technology development project KAAN, have been completed. The mission systems and subsystems that will take place on KAAN's first flight, which was disassembled down to the smallest piece, began to take their place on the aircraft after independent tests. This assembly activity will end with the engines taking their place in the prototype. KAAN, which will take to the runway after the assembly activity, will prepare for its first flight by completing its slow ang high speed taxi tests. It is aimed that these activities will intensify in mid-December and KAAN will make its first flight on December 27.

The paint has reportedly been stripped off. The maiden flight will occur with primer colors.

Via https://www.aa.com.tr/tr/savunma-sa...hazir-kaan-ilk-ucus-icin-son-montajda/3065767
If we don't see KAAN on the runway in a couple of days then it's highly unlikely for it to make its first flight this year.
 

godel44

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Do they really make the first flight on the given day? I would do it earlier on for both Kaan and ANKA-3 privately. Maybe they will do so as well and just not publicize.
 

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Bogeyman 

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Greek media began to fear that the British would send Rolls-Royce engines for the Kaan project.
Recently, the British gave a special blank check to British companies for the MMU project. Let's wish good luck to Rolls-Royce engines in the Kaan project.

The British Prime Minister canceled the press conference with the Greek Prime Minister at the last minute. Greece and British tensions are growing.
 

boredaf

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Greek media began to fear that the British would send Rolls-Royce engines for the Kaan project.
Recently, the British gave a special blank check to British companies for the MMU project. Let's wish good luck to Rolls-Royce engines in the Kaan project.
What they should really be scared of is that if right wingers keep winning elections more "Brexit"s will happen and they'll be up the shit creek without a paddle and a 300 billion euros of debt 😁

On the subject of engines, would we even be able to use any of RR's engine in Kaan or Hürjet? Wouldn't dimensions be a problem?
 

Bogeyman 

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What they should really be scared of is that if right wingers keep winning elections more "Brexit"s will happen and they'll be up the shit creek without a paddle and a 300 billion euros of debt 😁

On the subject of engines, would we even be able to use any of RR's engine in Kaan or Hürjet? Wouldn't dimensions be a problem?
In any case, the design of the aircraft will need to be comprehensively overhauled before we can use the engines on Kaan.
 

Spitfire9

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Greek media began to fear that the British would send Rolls-Royce engines for the Kaan project.
Recently, the British gave a special blank check to British companies for the MMU project. Let's wish good luck to Rolls-Royce engines in the Kaan project.
Yes, British companies can export goods etc for the KAAN but RR does not have a suitable engine. If Turkiye wanted to de-risk and accelerate TF35K development now would be a good time to call on RR's design know how.
 

Bogeyman 

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Yes, British companies can export goods etc for the KAAN but RR does not have a suitable engine. If Turkiye wanted to de-risk and accelerate TF35K development now would be a good time to call on RR's design know how.
We say Rolls-Royce engine, but the technical details of the agreement remain in the dark. So for now we can only speculate that an "agreement" has been reached. I guess we will continue to wait for details.
 

MhhJA

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Greek media began to fear that the British would send Rolls-Royce engines for the Kaan project.
Recently, the British gave a special blank check to British companies for the MMU project. Let's wish good luck to Rolls-Royce engines in the Kaan project.
https://assets.publishing.service.g...Aerospace-Industries-_TAI_-TF-X-Programme.pdf
If someone is interested in the details of the export control list, you can look it up here:
 

GoatsMilk

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The British Prime Minister canceled the press conference with the Greek Prime Minister at the last minute. Greece and British tensions are growing.

constantly trying to shut us down in the west is basically exposing greece as a hostile and open enemy. A time will come when they will have to be dealt with just like they were dealt with in 1974.

we can't keep allowing these transgressions to go unanswered indefinitely.

As for the British since the Americans are playing bad cop they will play good cop.
 

Bogeyman 

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constantly trying to shut us down in the west is basically exposing greece as a hostile and open enemy. A time will come when they will have to be dealt with just like they were dealt with in 1974.

we can't keep allowing these transgressions to go unanswered indefinitely.

As for the British since the Americans are playing bad cop they will play good cop.
If the British had not acted as good cops, Turkey would have had to buy Russian warplanes empty and equip them themselves. But now there is still hope to stay in NATO.
 

GoatsMilk

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If the British had not acted as good cops, Turkey would have had to buy Russian warplanes empty and equip them themselves. But now there is still hope to stay in NATO.

of course thats the game in play. Its too soon for them to see us join the other side due to their transgressions. Ideally they want to hinder us, stagnant us, fool us for as long as it possibly takes for them to build our enemies up to where they can stand on their own two feet. Isreal for one isnt secure enough yet for Turkiye to become allies with Iran.

Because if tomorrow it hits that point that nato wont sell us fighter jets or engines, makes no sense anymore to remain in NATO. Forces us to look east. And once you make that switch there is no easy way back if ever.

Turkiye leaving NATO will start a chain reaction in the middle east, eastern europe, the balkans and the caucses, maybe even north africa too.

Turks must always understand that under the FIVE EYES alliance the USA/UK coordinate their strategy against 3rd nations.
 

Sanchez

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The British Prime Minister canceled the press conference with the Greek Prime Minister at the last minute. Greece and British tensions are growing.
Created a real political crisis out of those marbles. This has been brewing for years. British point on this is clear, they don't let go of anything. Greeks are right on this. Parthenon marbles should return. This is actually one of few venues where Turkey and Greece both see eye to eye. Brits have many, many historical artifacts in British Museum that should return to their homes.

So for now we can only speculate that an "agreement" has been reached.
Has it? Export control relaxations are not directly a sign of a deal. I think it's fair to say that it is still very much in progress. In the past, IP issues and third party countries being part of the program stopped the RR Kale partnership. Hope they are solved, but can't say they are indeed solved just yet.
 
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