TR TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

Merzifonlu

Contributor
Think Tank Analyst
DefenceHub Diplomat
Messages
688
Reactions
24 2,051
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
How long have we been talking about turbine engines with the British? It's been a while, isn't it? How many RR engines have we bought, never mind built under license? "0". ZERO in writing. Pretty interesting, isn't it?
 

Zafer

Experienced member
Messages
4,448
Reactions
6 7,115
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
An upgrade of the TF10000 engine made with next generation turbine blade technology can be used to create capable twin engine fighters with possibly 10-15% power increase over previous generation.
 
Last edited:

boredaf

Contributor
Messages
965
Solutions
1
Reactions
11 2,721
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
How long have we been talking about turbine engines with the British? It's been a while, isn't it? How many RR engines have we bought, never mind built under license? "0". ZERO in writing. Pretty interesting, isn't it?
I'm willing to bet that it has more to with Tusaş wanting to continue using Pratt & Whitney engines which they've been not just using but building for a long time than RR's unwillingness to cooperate with us. And another bet I would happily take is that they would love to have us as customers as that would bump their market share a fair bit.
 

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
4,756
Reactions
11,675
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
How long have we been talking about turbine engines with the British? It's been a while, isn't it? How many RR engines have we bought, never mind built under license? "0". ZERO in writing. Pretty interesting, isn't it?
Times have changed,who knows.
 

Anmdt

Experienced member
Naval Specialist
Professional
Messages
5,132
Solutions
2
Reactions
95 22,871
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
Good question. It is still not too late to do so. Probably dealing with a war thorn Ukraine was easier than a RR that holds stronger cards in hand.
We should remember Adour is not wholely RR but RR&Turbomeca product, hence the French.
 

Anmdt

Experienced member
Naval Specialist
Professional
Messages
5,132
Solutions
2
Reactions
95 22,871
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
VTOL? For sake of God tell us your thoughts 🤕
I more referred to things related with production engineering, next iteration of the prototype, to be ready for the service, gain an operational status, new avionics, gap fillers etc. We shall notice it will need another iteration for supersonic flight.
 

Yasar_TR

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
3,024
Reactions
110 14,674
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
We should remember Adour is not wholely RR but RR&Turbomeca product, hence the French.
You are correct. The engine was produced as RR-Turbomeca.
But Rolls Royce produces this engine as RR only in Derby. Also RR has licensed production of this engine in Japan with Mitsubishi and licensed parts production in India. So getting this engine from RR direct should not present a problem.
The Adour engine was the renamed version of RR RB172 jet engine.
Turboméca and its later parent company SNECMA was used in building the casings, compressors and afterburner, Rolls-Royce building the rest of the components, and both companies undertaking final assembly.
The engine was originally known as RR-RB172. Later the name was changed to Adour. So the roots lie in RR.
 

Saithan

Experienced member
Denmark Correspondent
Messages
8,121
Reactions
21 18,695
Nation of residence
Denmark
Nation of origin
Turkey
You are correct. The engine was produced as RR-Turbomeca.
But Rolls Royce produces this engine as RR only in Derby. Also RR has licensed production of this engine in Japan with Mitsubishi and licensed parts production in India. So getting this engine from RR direct should not present a problem.
The Adour engine was the renamed version of RR RB172 jet engine.
Turboméca and its later parent company SNECMA was used in building the casings, compressors and afterburner, Rolls-Royce building the rest of the components, and both companies undertaking final assembly.
The engine was originally known as RR-RB172. Later the name was changed to Adour. So the roots lie in RR.

Specifications (Adour Mk 106)[edit]​

Data from Rolls-Royce[11]

General characteristics​

  • Type: Turbofan
  • Length: 114 inches (2.90 m)
  • Diameter: 22.3 inches (0.57 m)
  • Dry weight: 1,784 lb (809 kg)

Components​

  • Compressor: 2-stage LP, 5-stage HP
  • Turbine: 1-stage LP, 1-stage HP

Performance​



Specifications (T-2(K))[edit]​

Data from Jane's All The World's Aircraft 1976–77 [15]

General characteristics

  • Crew: 2
  • Length: 17.85 m (58 ft 7 in)
  • Wingspan: 7.88 m (25 ft 10 in)
  • Height: 4.39 m (14 ft 5 in)
  • Wing area: 21.8 m2 (235 sq ft)
  • Aspect ratio: 3
  • Airfoil: NACA 65 series (modified)
  • Empty weight: 6,197 kg (13,662 lb)
  • Gross weight: 9,675 kg (21,330 lb) clean
  • Max takeoff weight: 12,800 kg (28,219 lb) [16]
  • Fuel capacity: 3,823 L (1,010 US gal; 841 imp gal) internal fuel, with provision for up to 3x 833 L (220 US gal; 183 imp gal) drop-tanks
  • Powerplant: 2 × Ishikawa-Harima TF40-801A afterburning turbofan, 20.95 kN (4,710 lbf) thrust each dry, 31.76 kN (7,140 lbf) with afterburner
Performance

  • Maximum speed: 1,700 km/h (1,100 mph, 920 kn) at 10,975 m (36,007 ft)[16]
  • Maximum speed: Mach 1.6 at 11,000 m (36,000 ft) at MTOW clean
  • Ferry range: 2,870 km (1,780 mi, 1,550 nmi) with 3x drop tanks
  • Service ceiling: 15,240 m (50,000 ft)
  • Rate of climb: 177.833 m/s (35,006.5 ft/min)
  • Required field length: 1,525 m (5,003 ft)
Armament



I found it interesting that it was used on a T-2 trainer jet. and the trainer jet weight was twice that of Hurjet. But the powerplant wasnt as powerful as F404.

I would have thought that Hurjet being bigger wingspan etc. and weighing less than T-2 could have potentially used the RR engine as powerplant.

Hurjet specs from Wiki

Specifications (projected)[edit]​

Data from Manufacturer[1][13][14][15][16]

General characteristics

  • Crew: 2
  • Length: 13 m (42 ft 8 in)
  • Wingspan: 9.8 m (32 ft 2 in)
  • Height: 5.1 m (16 ft 9 in)
  • Wing area: 25 m2 (270 sq ft)
  • Empty weight: 1,200 kg (2,646 lb)
  • Gross weight: 2,721 kg (5,999 lb)
  • Max takeoff weight: 6,500 kg (14,330 lb)
  • Powerplant: 1 × F404-GE-102 afterburning turbofan, 78 kN (17,600 lbf) thrust
Performance

  • Maximum speed: Mach 1.4
  • Cruise speed: 460 km/h (290 mph, 250 kn)
  • Range: 2,222 km (1,381 mi, 1,200 nmi)
  • Service ceiling: 13,716 m (45,000 ft)
  • g limits: +8/-3 g
  • Rate of climb: 200 m/s (39,000 ft/min)

Specifications (F404-GE-402)[edit]​

Data from General Electric[9]

General characteristics​

Components​

Performance​


I get the feeling that F404 is overkill on Hurjet, what am I missing ?
 
Last edited:

Strong AI

Contributor
Messages
486
Reactions
20 2,128
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
I get the feeling that F404 is overkill on Hurjet, what am I missing ?
Maybe there will be a twin engine naval fighter version of Hürjet. F/A-18 uses two F404 engines too.
And for the naval trainer version of Hürjet would be a single F404 engine enough.
So the reason could be maintenance.
 

Anmdt

Experienced member
Naval Specialist
Professional
Messages
5,132
Solutions
2
Reactions
95 22,871
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
You are correct. The engine was produced as RR-Turbomeca.
But Rolls Royce produces this engine as RR only in Derby. Also RR has licensed production of this engine in Japan with Mitsubishi and licensed parts production in India. So getting this engine from RR direct should not present a problem.
The Adour engine was the renamed version of RR RB172 jet engine.
Turboméca and its later parent company SNECMA was used in building the casings, compressors and afterburner, Rolls-Royce building the rest of the components, and both companies undertaking final assembly.
The engine was originally known as RR-RB172. Later the name was changed to Adour. So the roots lie in RR.
Roots may lie in RR but i am wondering things related to IP rights. If it is solely on RR, then one thing comes to my mind in selection of Ukranian enginer and it doesn't sound good.

And i keep telling this but it is neither easy to get engines, as whole product, from Ukraine let alone the local assembly or manufacturing.
 

DBdev

Committed member
Messages
236
Reactions
8 435
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
Why F404?
A stronger engine gives room to grow for heavier variants. No need to worry if engine could cause problems in a national first jet project since it is a very stable safe engine. F404 is designed for trainer jets according to GE. To minimize compressor stalls and other engine failures. Additionally, the engine was intended to respond quickly to control inputs, as novice jet pilots transitioning from propeller planes to jets often complained about the lack of responsiveness in early turbojets. Also whenever an engine purchase comes up TEI intervenes on behalf of their partner GE since they were the only company that accepted to co produce engines in Türkiye ever.

That's what happened with EJ200 vs F110 at least. Also related to that since THY is ordering 300+ planes that should also come with local engine & plane production deals. Turgut Özal was smarter than our current leaders. He made local engine and plane production part of the F-16 fighter jet purchase. PW and GE were 2 candidates, he said the company who accepts this will get the contract. Instead of just giving it away like THY is doing, same should be done to force Airbus and Boeing compete against each other.
 

uçuyorum

Contributor
Messages
715
Reactions
9 1,154
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
When KAAN airframe becomes proper airworthy why don't we just quickly integrate avionics of özgür which are pretty much complete and MURAD that hopefully is like 2-3 years away for fastest interim solution? Are we planning to use BURFIS etc for first block? Because I don't want to be reading "Burfis prototype is being integrated to Akıncı-2 for tests" in 2035 while waiting for KAAN and even engine may be nearing completion.
 

Zafer

Experienced member
Messages
4,448
Reactions
6 7,115
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
2 days left.
2 days, right ?

1703504363356.png
 

Samba

Active member
Messages
51
Reactions
2 106
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
Why have not we heard much ground test news prior to the flight? Any ideas?
 

buraktunahan

Active member
Messages
48
Reactions
9 366
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
Why have not we heard much ground test news prior to the flight? Any ideas?
Ours is the only 5th generation fighter jet built under the eyes of the media all over the world. Of course, the elections in May also had an impact on this. But don't expect too much news and images (videos and photos) about KAAN anymore. From now on, the project will be carried out as it should be, out of sight and secret.
 

Boz

Committed member
DH Visual Specialist
Messages
275
Reactions
20 2,557
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
Tomorrow.
GCQn0_vXAAAjqE-

Çakal Çökerten Zeybeği
00:27 ━❍──────── 2:17
◁◁ ▐ ▌ ▷▷
VOLUME: ▁▂▃▄▅▆▇ 100%
 

Follow us on social media

Top Bottom