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Nilgiri

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Okay, thank you both for your answers. I was actually not trying to argue with you. I just wanted to show the people who read this place what kind of people are the AKP supporters, what kind moral and ethic codes they have. How they want to normalize dirty relations and bribery under the cover of Islam.

What İsmail Demir did, was a crime according our laws.

He will take jail time for this crime.


@UkroTurk 🚬 @Deliorman @xenon5434 @T-123456 @Saithan @tornadoss @Nilgiri @Vag

Bro, you have made your point with political favouritism of posters (and larger set of folks sharing their view) w.r.t strict rule of law and the whataboutism excuses that come out inevitably to dilute and/or justify. It is nothing new in human nature.

I have circled this tree many times among my own too (and introspect for my own views a lot and have to shed when I cannot find them logically sound).

So I am no stranger to it and yes often the best approach is to simply illustrate to audience (rather than focus too much time on convincing the inconvincible) and stay true to legal, ethical logic all throughout it.

But as @Anmdt says, I too have long realised the biggest issue is implementation and execution of the legal system....when legal system theory/concept is already ideal or close to it. As an Engineer (i.e applied science) rather than Scientist, this strikes me in similar way in day to day.

The words written in constitution remain mere words if the edifices that exist in its name to provide strict, unbiased and effective justice....are lacking and/or have been corrupted/re-purposed/hijacked in their original pristine sanctioned duty.

Were judges appointed in political favour environment? How are they appointed, and by whom? What are their track records on crucial cases? How much % do they make of total number of judges? What are the proven size of largest lapses in justice?..and their downstream effects now? How is this debated in Turkish society, how much is allowed to be debated?

How many cases are even brought to fore (to judicial system) by justice dept of ruling govt i.e attorney general) in first place?

A 50 grand Euro gift (illegal for recipient to take as you have pointed out) is few trees in huge forest that is seemingly being ignored for a long ongoing time.

It is also one of many forests in the world....I do not even need to look up what are the specific names for these terms in Turkey....as I know the overall contours for countries I hold dear to my heart, that I have studied and participated in such observation and debate for a long time.

If there is good sustained track record of concrete action on the forest (for the things of large scale, nipped in bud so they do not rot and fester and agglomerate and gather precedence power-inertia of their own weight).....if there is such the action on specific trees will proceed by default as a norm.

But the reverse is also true....and the reverse seems to be the weighted reality in too many countries (that should know and act better) these days.

I can go on at some length about this stuff, I have done so before (and others have done far far more)....but I have found that for most part either people get it or they dont at very early level of this. I have had to re-orient how I tackle this with lot more pragmatism than before....as most humans are simply not pure rational beings.

i.e Going further is just theoretical somewhat futile exercise among the very few worthies (that exist in every society), and the city is burning around us regardless....

@Saiyan0321 @Joe Shearer @VCheng
 

Khagan1923

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MHP is dead and AKP is following it.

In 2 years this country will finally say bye bye to corruption, trolls, crime, incompetence and mafia influence inside the state.

And say welcome back to justice, fairness, competence, diplomacy and human rights.

And those who took away justice from other over the last 20 years will be begging for it in courts as their are judged for their crimes against the citizens of Turkey and the Republic of Turkey itself.

If the trends continue CHP+IYI+DEVA will most likely build the next ruling coalition.

Remember what I wrote a month ago here? @Sinan @xenon5434

CHP will breach 27% and IYI easily 17% I said. I just go the timeline wrong. I thought it would take till the beginning of next year but with this speed CHP might see 28-29% and IYI 18% at the beginning of next year.

We might see CHP overtake AKP soon in votershare. And DEVA overtake MHP.

Yavas 16 points (Undecided vote can't save Erdogan even if he got 100% of those he would still lose by 5 points)
Aksener 5 points
Kiliclaroglu 6 points
Imamoglu 15 points (Same for Imamoglu here Erdogan if he got all 100% of the undecided vote would still lose by 8 points(Huge!))

ahead of Erdogan. Yes even Kiliclaroglu.

There is nothing to talk about anymore about this Election. The topic should switch to what the new government need to do after election to steer the country back into the light.

Domestic Policy and Foreign Policy.
Investments.
Diplomacy.
Refugee crisis.
Military.
Which Departments to dismantle.
Which Departments to found.
 

Philips

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How desperate must one be to talk about a potential election victory two whole years in the future..🙃
 

UkroTurk 🚬

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On behalf of whom did Veyis Ateş ask 10 million Euros, and who did he mediate?

After the statements of the crime leader Sedat Peker, the dirty relations of a fellow journalist were exposed. After it was revealed that Habertürk's Veyis Ateş had asked fugitive Sezgin Baran Korkmaz for 10 million euros to "solve his business", it was asked who asked for this money.

Habertürk writer Fatih Altaylı, in his article yesterday, stated that Sezgin Baran Korkmaz, who fled abroad, called him, and said that he made shameful accusations against Habertürk TV announcer Veyis Ateş.

Note that previous video Sedat Peker claimed that S.B. Korkmaz had visited minister of Interior in his office. Still Minister of Interior hasn't refused it.

 

CAN_TR

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MHP votes go down the drain and AKP will probably again start cuddling with HDP, like in the good old times.

My guess about DEVA was that it would end up like SAADET/GELECEK somewhere in the 1-2%, but ffs they could surpass MHP.
 

UkroTurk 🚬

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Gunman who attacked HDP office detained in Turkey's Izmir
122587.jpg
A person was detained after attacking a pro-PKK Peoples' Democratic Party (HDP) provincial office in western Turkey's Izmir province, June 17, 2021. (AA Photo)
BY DAILY SABAH
JUN 17, 2021 12:21 PM
Aperson was detained after attacking a pro-PKK Peoples' Democratic Party (HDP) provincial office in western Turkey's Izmir province on Thursday and killing one person.
The attacker entered the building with a gun and proceeded to fire rounds from the window toward the street.
After an operation conducted by a police team, the attacker was caught and detained.
According to a later statement by the HDP, the attacker set the building on fire and an HDP official was killed.


My dear friends, unfortunately, we will experience much bigger attacks then the Izmir HDP provincial chairmanship in the coming days. If you believe in my experience and sincerity, do not go out streets under any circumstances.

A huge game is being built. If you go out on the street, deep mehmet and his men will involve the members of the terrorist organizations and turn the place into a fire.
 

mulj

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With whom perpetuator is connected?
 

UkroTurk 🚬

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MHP votes go down the drain and AKP will probably again start cuddling with HDP, like in the good old times.

My guess about DEVA was that it would end up like SAADET/GELECEK somewhere in the 1-2%, but ffs they could surpass MHP.
There are a lot of conservative and liberal AKP voters who don't like the coalition with nationalists. I find DEVA has potential.
 

Sinan

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With whom perpetuator is connected?
Do moment he caught, he said "I'm not connected to anyone or any group, i did this on my own."

Deep state if you ask me, just like Sedat Peker said.
 

Sinan

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There are a lot of conservative and liberal AKP voters who don't like the coalition with nationalists. I find DEVA has potential.
Unfortunetly, DEVA is not increasing it's votes. They are going between %2.5 - %1.5 for months. Instead IYI parti is on the rise.
 

what

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None of these smaller parties will probably campaign on their own instead we will again see election alliances. So we will see all of them in the parliament, question is which block will have more votes.

We might see the same scenario as in Israel, Bibi vs. a huge block of parties that just want Erdogan to be gone. We just need one candidate that can gather all the voters and by the looks of it indirect support of HDP.
 

Lool

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Gunman who attacked HDP office detained in Turkey's Izmir
122587.jpg
A person was detained after attacking a pro-PKK Peoples' Democratic Party (HDP) provincial office in western Turkey's Izmir province, June 17, 2021. (AA Photo)
BY DAILY SABAH
JUN 17, 2021 12:21 PM
Aperson was detained after attacking a pro-PKK Peoples' Democratic Party (HDP) provincial office in western Turkey's Izmir province on Thursday and killing one person.
The attacker entered the building with a gun and proceeded to fire rounds from the window toward the street.
After an operation conducted by a police team, the attacker was caught and detained.
According to a later statement by the HDP, the attacker set the building on fire and an HDP official was killed.


My dear friends, unfortunately, we will experience much bigger attacks then the Izmir HDP provincial chairmanship in the coming days. If you believe in my experience and sincerity, do not go out streets under any circumstances.

A huge game is being built. If you go out on the street, deep mehmet and his men will involve the members of the terrorist organizations and turn the place into a fire.
I cant believe that the time when a top mafia leader who escaped to the UAE says "If you believe in my experience and sincerity" to the ppl and the ppl believe it as if he is some sort of a national hero.
Some things are strange here
The timings are too weird
(Just like how sedat pecker times the release of his videos whenever erdo inaugurates a new project)
Like nothing happened for the HDP for the past 2 years or so and suddenly after sedat pecker videos some1 just Go kill a member of the HDP; NOW public opinion will feel empathy towards the HDP and voila ppl starts loving the HDP again
This is literally Egypt 101 all over again; the UAE deserves a lot of praise on how they are twisting public opinion

Just saying, i dont agree with the killing; like honestly, killing that woman wont do shit; if u wanna hurt the hdp, go for the big brass (those who wanna divide turkey) otherwise just remain in your home. However, the timings elude me tbh
 

Akhtar

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View attachment 23338
Ex AKP MP and columnist:


So we weren't under crusader siege

Now we have come to the end of the story… On the one hand, we adjusted to Europe by saying "Nazis are Nazis...", and on the other hand, we found the bottom of the rhythm with statements such as "Imperialist powers are in alliance with the traitors inside to stop Turkey's growth", pointing to the United States.

And now, seeing the end of the story, we set off to rediscover America and Europe. The evaluations of President Tayyip Erdoğan after the bilateral meetings with Western leaders, especially Biden, on the occasion of the NATO summit in Brussels, show that Turkey is in a new search. In fact, these negotiations and evaluations are quite natural for a country that is a NATO member. This is the natural behavior of all countries within the alliance family.

Unnatural; It was his evaluation of the world in which Turkey is located as a "Crusader mentality..." I think Turkey is no longer seeing the West as an alliance that came together to destroy us…

President Erdogan's evaluations after the talks tell us this.

Describing the meeting with Biden as "extremely helpful and sincere", Erdogan said: "We see that there is a strong will to start a period of productive cooperation based on mutual respect and interest in all fields. We think that there is no unsolvable problem in Turkey-US relations, on the contrary, our areas of cooperation show a broader and richer outlook than the problem headings.”

This meeting also confirmed that Turkey is determined to strengthen relations with the United States. In fact, saying that on the way to the NATO summit that Biden would bring up the definition of 1915 as the "Armenian genocide" on April 24, Mr. Erdogan clearly demonstrated this determination by saying "Thank God it never came to the agenda" in the bilateral meeting.

Regarding his meeting with President Erdoğan Makron, he said the following: “Syria focused on whether we could do a joint study on Libya. We said we can do it. We will continue our discussions on this issue.”

Although concrete steps could not be taken regarding the PYD-PKK, S-400s and F-35s, it seems that there is a determined will to take joint steps with America and Europe.

So we were not under the siege of the Crusaders…

It means that foreign powers were not responsible for the economic crisis, the 128 billion dollars to whom it was sold, for how much, corruption, nepotism, and the bad smells emanating from the gang-mafia-politics axis...

This means that rational relations with all countries in economic and political terms can be maintained on the condition that mutual interests are taken as a basis.

No matter what anyone says, this is a strange country. I don't really know how to understand how journalists, academics and all those close to the government, who until yesterday, "we are fighting for liberation against the imperialist powers", suddenly display an Americanist image and turn into a "patty of love". They probably know something...

Mess of foreign policy

Do moment he caught, he said "I'm not connected to anyone or any group, i did this on my own."

Deep state if you ask me, just like Sedat Peker said.

He was a state paramedic or something and went to Syria a few times, met with SNA commander and Turkish soldiers. Maybe was involved with some of the militias in SNA, not much info yet. SADAT conspiracy theories floating around.

E4FCnucXwAIsfxi.jpgE4FCnuqWUAMwEYB.jpg


Whoever let him hold that MPT rifle should be suspended.

He went to this Turkish base in Syria:


I also think this is deep state or something. The HDP usually have police swarming them when they step outside to make public statements, they know when these will happen as I assume they watch the buildings. How did guys with guns just walk in ? I don't know if HDP are telling the truth about cancelling their meeting that was going to take place with 40+ people that day either. But this guy killed the woman he found and tried to set fire to the building. He also expected there to be more based on his whatsapp story:

E4GVC0YWEBU1mmi.jpg

That is supposedly the corpse of this victim that he executed, she was supposedly there alone to clean the building:

E4GQHOPXwAA4CtR.jpg

If not deep state, this is a growing population of ultranationalists/AKP people that could commit these shootings at any time. The economy is in the shit and there are many like this guy who go to Syria for war tourism and such. Reminds of this stuff on TV, the AKP people saying they are ready to kill:


It's not healthy in society.
 
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Nein2.0(Nomad)

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So a ultranationalist terrorist attacks the party of terrorists.

Irony at its best.
 

mulj

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Mess of foreign policy



He was a state paramedic or something and went to Syria a few times, met with SNA commander and Turkish soldiers. Maybe was involved with some of the militias in SNA, not much info yet. SADAT conspiracy theories floating around.

View attachment 23465View attachment 23466


Whoever let him hold that MPT rifle should be suspended.

He went to this Turkish base in Syria:


I also think this is deep state or something. The HDP usually have police swarming them when they step outside to make public statements, they know when these will happen as I assume they watch the buildings. How did guys with guns just walk in ? I don't know if HDP are telling the truth about cancelling their meeting that was going to take place with 40+ people that day either. But this guy killed the woman he found and tried to set fire to the building. He also expected there to be more based on his whatsapp story:

View attachment 23468

That is supposedly the corpse of this victim that he executed, she was supposedly there alone to clean the building:

View attachment 23469

If not deep state, this is a growing population of ultranationalists/AKP people that could commit these shootings at any time. The economy is in the shit and there are many like this guy who go to Syria for war tourism and such. Reminds of this stuff on TV, the AKP people saying they are ready to kill:


It's not healthy in society.
For me it is now clearer, as he went to syria as paramedic he saw first hand what hdp ideological brothers do and probably he snaped, do not beleive in deep state conspiracy just bittered and emotiomally triģerred individual.
 

CAN_TR

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It was a hate based attack, could also be a mental problem who knows.
 
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