TR UAV/UCAV Programs | Anka - series | Kızılelma | TB - series

[Huelague]

I prefer Aksungur over Akinci. More difficult to hit by a missile.

 

[Huelague]

I hope we are working on an indigenous IDAS missile, because I think our project with Diehl is canceled.

 

[Fuzuli NL]

I prefer Aksungur over Akinci. More difficult to hit by a missile.

I believe that they'd have different missions, just like the Anka and TB2, Not really comparable.
The most important thing that many of us here keep forgetting is that they could be produced as many as needed, they're all Turkish products and they all are weaponised. I just wish that we could see some Karayel-SU in our inventory.

 

[kimov]

I prefer Aksungur over Akinci. More difficult to hit by a missile.

Why do you think Aksungur would be more difficult to hit?
Both of them fly at similar speeds and altitude. They also have similar sizes.

 

[kimov]

Video from Akinci's test last month
Note that the FLIR+COM is internal until needed.
Note also that the wings from MAM-T expands immediately. The wing did not expand until after 700m drop by my calculation in the previous released MAM-T video.

 

[Spook]

MAM-L was flagship munition for TB2, MAM-T will be for Akinci. What about MIUS.

 

[TheInsider]

Don't be surprised if MIUS carries Kuzgun in internal stations

 

[kimov]

What about MIUS.

Hopefully internal Bozdogan + Gökdogan as we need a test bed for next gen A2A drones after current A2G drones.

 

[Era_shield]

Video from Akinci's test last month
Note that the FLIR+COM is internal until needed.
Note also that the wings from MAM-T expands immediately. The wing did not expand until after 700m drop by my calculation in the previous released MAM-T video.

In this video the MAM-T is attached to the Akinici with wings already expanded.

 

[kimov]

In this video the MAM-T is attached to the Akinici with wings already expanded.

Yeah, you are correct.
will edit

 

[Oublious]

It seems UK is one of the customers.

 

[Yasar_TR]

ABD Medyası: "Rusya, Türk İHA'larının Alıcısı Olmanın Eşiğinde"

“Rusya son dönemde silah ithalatını artırdı. Moskova Türk askeri teçhizatlarının, özellikle de insansız hava araçlarının alıcısı olmanın eşiğinde…” Amerikan National Interest’de yayımlanan analiz M5 tarafından çevrilmiştir. “Dünya üzerinde ülkeler arasındaki silah ihracatı hem büyük bir ekonomik...

m5dergi.com

According to the US media, Russians are going to be shopping for some TB2’s.
Mr Cavusoglu in a statement has mentioned that “just as we purchased Russian S400, Russians can too purchase the TB2”
I can’t believe this can happen! It has so many repercussions!

 

[Huelague]

Why do you think Aksungur would be more difficult to hit?
Both of them fly at similar speeds and altitude. They also have similar sizes.

Same size? Akinci has size of a small passenger plane .

 

[kimov]

Same size? Akinci has size of a small passenger plane .

Not same size but they have similar size. Length is about the same at 12m, while Akinci have somewhat bigger height and Aksungur have longer wingspan.

These small differences in size are not really important. Shape, design, material and internal components will have bigger impact on radar cross section. Honestly, I don't know which one of these will have larger RCS as small difference can have big impact, specially from different point of views. So at this point, I would not be able to tell which design is more vulnerable. Honestly, I don't think we will ever have that kind of information directly.

Akinci have

• Length: 12.5 m
• Wingspan: 20 m
• Height: 4.1 m

Aksungar have

• Length: 12 m
• Wingspan: 24 m
• Height: 3 m

 

[kimov]

ABD Medyası: "Rusya, Türk İHA'larının Alıcısı Olmanın Eşiğinde"

“Rusya son dönemde silah ithalatını artırdı. Moskova Türk askeri teçhizatlarının, özellikle de insansız hava araçlarının alıcısı olmanın eşiğinde…” Amerikan National Interest’de yayımlanan analiz M5 tarafından çevrilmiştir. “Dünya üzerinde ülkeler arasındaki silah ihracatı hem büyük bir ekonomik...

m5dergi.com

According to the US media, Russians are going to be shopping for some TB2’s.
Mr Cavusoglu in a statement has mentioned that “just as we purchased Russian S400, Russians can too purchase the TB2”
I can’t believe this can happen! It has so many repercussions!

From a technical point of view, I dont think such a sale would matter that much since they already have multiple TB2s which have been downed in different theaters which they could study for vulnerabilities. They could obviously use functioning drones to develop new counter tactics but that can be done with any other small tactical drone as well as long as they have similar radar response. To my knowledge, they already developed Korsar which is a TB2 clone for that purpose. Korsar really does not need to be that good for their intended purpose.

From a political point of view, it would not be good, specially for Ukraine/Poland/Hungary/... which we intend to collaborate with. For other NATO/EU countries, who cares as they obviously don't care about Turkish security concerns in Syria/Iraq/Iran/Azerbaijan/Greece/Libya/Egypt/.....

So, unless we are talking about several hundred TB2 then it is not worth it.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Not same size but they have similar size. Length is about the same at 12m, while Akinci have somewhat bigger height and Aksungur have longer wingspan.

These small differences in size are not really important. Shape, design, material and internal components will have bigger impact on radar cross section. Honestly, I don't know which one of these will have larger RCS as small difference can have big impact, specially from different point of views. So at this point, I would not be able to tell which design is more vulnerable. Honestly, I don't think we will ever have that kind of information directly.

Akinci have

• Length: 12.5 m
• Wingspan: 20 m
• Height: 4.1 m

Aksungar have

• Length: 12 m
• Wingspan: 24 m
• Height: 3 m

As a general rule. Aerodynamic designs are more susceptible to radar waves being reflected. Most stealthy designs have rectangular lines with straight facias. Composite materials and radar wave-absorbing materials and paints plus the intentionally produced internal components will make a planes RCS value shrink.
Two large turboprops will not really help though!
Like you say ; Unless they give us the actual values, there is no way to know if any of these two are really stealthy or not.

 

[Yasar_TR]

From a technical point of view, I dont think such a sale would matter that much since they already have multiple TB2s which have been downed in different theaters which they could study for vulnerabilities. They could obviously use functioning drones to develop new counter tactics but that can be done with any other small tactical drone as well as long as they have similar radar response. To my knowledge, they already developed Korsar which is a TB2 clone for that purpose. Korsar really does not need to be that good for their intended purpose.

From a political point of view, it would not be good, specially for Ukraine/Poland/Hungary/... which we intend to collaborate with. For other NATO/EU countries, who cares as they obviously don't care about Turkish security concerns in Syria/Iraq/Iran/Azerbaijan/Greece/Libya/Egypt/.....

So, unless we are talking about several hundred TB2 then it is not worth it.

It is the last two paragraph contents of your article that I was worried about. Why sell these to Ukraine’s arch enemy?

 

[kimov]

It is the last two paragraph contents of your article that I was worried about. Why sell these to Ukraine’s arch enemy?

I know, the problem is that, what if they wanted to buy 500 TB2 for 10B$ or even more?
I know this is totally unrealistic but I just want to highlight some concerns.

If the only problem were Ukraine then we could easily resolve that by giving them the communication encryption keys and 10 TB2 with Sungur to shoot down other TB2 drones . These are after all not that difficult to shoot down once you know where they are. Such a scenario would actually beneficial for Ukraine.

The biggest problem would be politics with USA which is really difficult to resolve in a good manner.
We would also effectly kill our own realistic sales opportunities to other countries.
So, I dont think there will be any sale of TB2 to Russia and they are most likely not interested than 2-5 to test it.

 

[Hexciter]

UCAV developments dovetail with evolving Turkish Navy operational concepts​

19th May 2021 by Tayfun Özberk
Turkish naval tactics are on the cusp of change by applying UCAV stand-off attack capabilities.
Progress in domestic UAV production is aiding efforts by the Turkish Navy to develop CONOPS involving UCAVs.
The navy first applied a form of manned-unmanned teaming in March during the Blue Homeland exercise, when a Bayraktar TB2 UCAV hit a training target with MAM-L smart micromunition from the maximum range (15km).
This was the first time the Turkish Navy used a UCAV to hit a sea target in close cooperation with crewed assets.
Another guided-munition test firing occurred in the Black Sea on 25 April, involving an AksungurMALE UCAV from Turkish Aerospace Industries.

Selected specifications from Shephard Defence Insight for Turkish UCAVs.


Available data suggests that Aksungur is the Turkish-made UCAV with the highest payload capacity and longest mission endurance. It carried out the live firing at 20,000ft altitude and hit the naval target successfully with a KGK-SIHA-82 guided munition at a range of 30km.
This was the first time Aksungur UCAV carried and launched the KGK-SIHA-82 with a wing-assisted guidance kit and 340kg warhead. It was also the first time that Aksungur engaged a naval target.
'We continue on our way with determination. Our UCAVs have been getting stronger with the test fires of new ammunition,' Ismail Demir, head of the Turkish Presidency of Defense Industries, tweeted after the 25 April event.
Meanwhile, Baykar has been trialling its AkinciUCAV, which can operate at 40,000ft altitude and launch the indigenous SOM-J anti-ship missilewith a range of 250km (potentially giving the Turkish Navy a considerable degree of stand-off hitting power).

Aksungur carrying KGK-SIHA-82. (Photo: SSB)

UCAV developments seem to offer new possibilities for the Turkish Navy to deal with hostile fast attack craft (FAC) and corvettes in the littoral waters of the Aegean Sea. In littoral warfare, FACs would approach very close to the Aegean islands as a countermeasure against RF- or IR-guided anti-ship missiles (because most of these missiles cannot distinguish between a ship and an island if the two objects are very close to each other).
Generally, attack helicopters would be employed to engage such FACs because these craft have weak air defence capabilities. However, the integration of UCAVs with naval warfare (particularly littoral warfare) would mean that small surface combatants can be neutralised without entering the stand-off range of their air defence weapons.
UCAVs offer the prospect of tactical elasticity by conducting high-risk missions without risking the lives of pilots. Increasing the firepower and endurance of these unmanned platforms is set to change naval warfare tactics.

UCAV developments dovetail with evolving Turkish Navy operational concepts | Shephard

Turkish naval tactics are on the cusp of change by applying UCAV stand-off attack capabilities.

www.shephardmedia.com

 

[Hexciter]

According to the news in the Ukrainian media, the Ukrainian Council of Ministers has come to an end in the allocation of a land area for the joint production of Bayraktar TB2 and other Baykar products in the country and making the necessary regulations in the laws. Official proceedings will be completed soon.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1398238732067684353