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Anmdt

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Why shouldn't Gökdeniz use fixed face radars of the warship? Having an Autonomous CIWS is necessary? İf yes , i would put on Gökdeniz two fixed meteksans Retinar instead of rotating MAR-D since half turn of rotating radar is blind.
View attachment 63425

İmagine as if GÜRZ CIWS had just two fixed AESA panel. Or just need to fix two radars from GÜRZ on Gökdeniz.
View attachment 63426 View attachment 63428
I misunderstood the question so interpreted as ship's radar. Gokdeniz was introduced before this radar tech so deliveries are being made with conventional layout. But we would naturally expect these radar techs to find a place in CIWS. I think Aselsan's radar suits better to it. And Meteksan's radar would be great as perimeter survailance radar or low-cost FCR for stabilized guns (against cheap drones etc.).
 

UkroTurk

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I really wonder why radar antenna should rotate just one direction which gives just circular scan.
İmagine Gökdeniz radar first turning right then stops and again turning back to the left. So it would be sectoral scan.
I don't think it's a big deal turning antenna back and forth.
 

Aloster

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I really wonder why radar antenna should rotate just one direction which gives just circular scan.
İmagine Gökdeniz radar first turning right then stops and again turning back to the left. So it would be sectoral scan.
I don't think it's a big deal turning antenna back and forth.
  • Sector Dimming and Sector Clipping features exist at MAR-D but I don't know how its work.
 

UkroTurk

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  • Sector Dimming and Sector Clipping features exist at MAR-D but I don't know how its work.
İt's electronically (AESA feature) not mechanically. Still there are blind spots behind the antenna.

İ meant, mechanically need to add reverse mechanism, forwarding motor.
Yelpaze hareketi gibi.
 

Tornadoss

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İt's electronically (AESA feature) not mechanically. Still there are blind spots behind the antenna.

İ meant, mechanically need to add reverse mechanism, forwarding motor.
Yelpaze hareketi gibi.
Because there need to be a force to stop it then redirect, and it would be more prone to error. Things are easier with full rotation.
 

Brave Janissary

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I know there are 4. They are for 360degree real time coverage. But Gökdeniz at the back of the frigate so rear panels are useless.
2 plates could give 180 degree realtime coverage for Gökdeniz which positioned at the back.
Usage of Mar-d on gökdeniz which is located on i class looks like it isn’t meant for gökdeniz.

In my opinion (also many experts have same) for air defence engagements our barbaros mlu's and istif's don’t have enough sensor capability. Just because changeing mode smart-s mk2 to more accurate for missile engagment create a great gap the long range search capability of ship. Ship needs a more accurate second radar (x band) for seeking aerial targets in siper-hisar ranges. Also we will hopefully give a guidance support to missile until midcourse with akr-d b2 fcr. So Mar-d with 100-120 km range and x band capability create a great secondery x band radar for ship. Like Çafrad-Umr/Çafrad-çfr just more basic and limited version.

On the other hand aesa radar panels on gürz is not special for gürz. you can see same radar panels in hisar-d rf ship based fire control system project. İf you look last aselsan magazine page 147 looks like we will see same panels on istif class and maybe barbaros mlu.

But yes on gürz also have akr radar for fcr. Most probably, aesa panels will be used for search radar for gürz and fire control radar for hisar-d rf. (aesa panels are very multicapable things.)

And last with all of this idea , if I must give an answer to ; why locating of mar-d in istanbul on the gökdeniz when compared mlu more diffrent position ? Gökdeniz on barbaros mlu is front of the ships so there are already coverage area of smart-s mk2 radar. You need to separate radar from system. But on to istif class gökdeniz on the behind. There are no coverage problems. Mar-d already on the gökdeniz ecosystem and can work independent power source.
 
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UkroTurk

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Can you notice the difference between 3 Gökdeniz? There was an experimental one that MAR-D was seperated from turret so MAR-D not moving with turret.
IMG_20231209_142046.jpg
IMG_20231209_143450.jpg


Now here is my crazy project:

MAR-D is separated from turret and standing behind the gun. Not rotates but fixed 2 compact AESA panels on two sides thus the ship will have real time no gap coverage.

Also added UMTAS against USVs and SUNGUR against UAVs/AShM.

IMG_20231209_143340.jpg


IMG_20231209_145022.jpg


İt could be applied in Barbaros MLU as frontal CIWS.

Kinda GÜRZ +Gökdeniz
IMG_20231209_145317.jpg
 
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Anmdt

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Can you notice the difference between 3 Gökdeniz? There was an experimental one that MAR-D was seperated from turret so MAR-D not moving with turret.
View attachment 63738 View attachment 63739

Now here is my crazy project:

MAR-D is separated from turret and standing behind the gun. Not rotates but fixed 2 compact AESA panels on two sides thus the ship will have real time no gap coverage.

Also added UMTAS against USVs and SUNGUR against UAVs/AShM.

View attachment 63740

View attachment 63741

İt could be applied in Barbaros MLU as frontal CIWS.

Kinda GÜRZ +Gökdeniz
View attachment 63742
First one is Korkut-D, experimental version of 'Gokdeniz'. Second one is Gokdeniz integrated on Turkmenistan Navy Corvette, Third one is the last and final iteration of Gokdeniz with little modification. Both second-third images were made to fit Mar-D.

For the AESA we will see what Aselsan will come up with. They can just install 4 x planes to scan-track simultaneously or split scan and track like South Korean CIWS with AESA. LIG Nex1 and Hanwha had two concepts for what called CIWS-II.
 

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Why folks are asking for UMTAS when there is a 76mm gun.
 

Anmdt

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Why folks are asking for UMTAS when there is a 76mm gun.
UMTAS was never old school UMTAS, but GM B1 - B2 with BLOS capability. 4 UMTAS GM B2 in each side could be lovely. (Maybe will be).
No Umtas launchers on the sides of Gökdeniz, but there will be diver detection dipping sonars?

May not be in contract but planned for later? Haven't seen a foundation for Yalman turret either.
 

Sanchez

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Why folks are asking for UMTAS when there is a 76mm gun.
More than Umtas, a Yalman launcher. Add 4 Umtas-GMs on it, would be a great NLOS weapons platform for shallow seas against anything smaller than a corvette.
May not be in contract but planned for later? Haven't seen a foundation for Yalman turret either.
TBH I never liked that location for Yalmans. Would steal from Gökdeniz's operating angle. Maybe at the back, behind RCWS? Or maybe it's time they go for a gun+missile approach.
 

UkroTurk

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No Umtas launchers on the sides of Gökdeniz, but there will be diver detection dipping sonars?

Messy

The geometry of the battleship doesn't seem to be considered at all. They put everything they have into it. Like Soviet battleships of the 1970s. I guess it's for testing purposes.

Where are the Fixed AESA radars?

Guided UMTAS for me is very important against USV. They know better.
 

dBSPL

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Hermes team noticed a detail in this news. According to the Spanish media outlet, the two countries have agreed to work on a possible cooperation for a new medium-term joint submarine construction program. I have not checked the news source and have no idea about its reliability. The reason I am sharing it is that it seems that this issue is not only being speculated on our side, but is also being discussed in Spanish defense circles.

 

Anmdt

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Hermes team noticed a detail in this news. According to the Spanish media outlet, the two countries have agreed to work on a possible cooperation for a new medium-term joint submarine construction program. I have not checked the news source and have no idea about its reliability. The reason I am sharing it is that it seems that this issue is not only being speculated on our side, but is also being discussed in Spanish defense circles.

InfoDefensa again? I haven't clicked the link and i may tell it is them. A bit unreliable and exaggerates existing information bits.
 

Sanchez

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InfoDefensa again? I haven't clicked the link and i may tell it is them. A bit unreliable and exaggerates existing information bits.
Piece is from November 7, around the time we discussed it. So nothing new.
 

dBSPL

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InfoDefensa again? I haven't clicked the link and i may tell it is them. A bit unreliable and exaggerates existing information bits.
Piece is from November 7, around the time we discussed it. So nothing new.
Okay, that's clear. Probably an echo of the baseless speculation here.
 

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Commander of Turkish Naval Forces Admiral Ercüment Tatlıoğlu:

"Work is continuing on the development of a 260-280m aircraft carrier, which is larger than the TCG Anadolu, for our Naval Forces."

 

Cabatli_TR

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Mr Tatlıoğlu: "There were some adjustments on TTAB project. It was too big in terms of tonnage and its speed was low. We wanted to increase the speed because speed is very important for us."

images-246.jpeg
 

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