TR Naval Programs

[Anmdt]

That is shortsightedness. What would we have done if we had no DM2A4 to furnish the Reis Class with?
When US stopped the sale of MK41 VLS, we built our own VLS; namely MIDLAS.
Besides as well as “us” knowing this torpedo “well”, so do our adversaries. So they probably already devised defence procedures against it. Akya, on the other hand, is a closed box.

I agree with your question on Orka. That is a real game changer weapon. It can be deployed from air as well as from USVs. The sooner we have it in our inventory the better.

That is Meltem with lightweight torpedoes.
View attachment 71064

That is a Seahawk helicopter deploying a lightweight torpedo.

View attachment 71065

That is a USV with a torpedo

View attachment 71066

@Sanchez is right, Reis Class does not come with the Akya capability right away and needs a rework (on the component level) for integration & testing (qualification in a nutshell). For the time being AKYA production rates are no match to keep up with the stock (old torpedoes are either modernized or spent in exercises, or decommissioned).

6 Reis -> 6 x 20 = 120 torpedoes needed within 5 years from now on plus the training torpedoes and the ones to spent during qualification. This is the number excluding the modernization programs which will render some torpedoes useless as they are out of the date.

(Also note, this is a single time load of a Reis, approximating one holds 8 in cell, and 12 in the hull to reload, entirely excluding a scenario which hull returns to base for replenishment).

50 DM2A4, 50 Mk48 and ~90 AKYA in 10 years seem like a decent stock to me. If any of the outsourced torpedoes are embargoes we will simply burn money to increase production.

AKYA also needs a maturing process, which is ongoing to be introduced after LRIP.

 

[TR_123456]

The whole purpose of Akya torpedo was to replace the ageing DM2A4 (Seahake) torpedoes. So why are we still trying to buy these from Germany?

View attachment 71062
According to Naval News Akya already proved itself by sinking it’s target in a test firing in December 2023.
After this test with the real warhead, AKYA HWT achieved initial operational capability.
It is confusing that we are still after a foreign weapon that we and most of our adversaries know the details of .

SINKEX: Turkiye's first indigenous heavyweight torpedo AKYA sinks target at live test - Naval News

On Dec. 27, 2023, the Turkish Navy successfully carried out the first live firing test of the AKYA HWT with a real warhead in the East Med.

www.navalnews.com

Didnt we buy the 6 U214's all inclusive?
Maybe that is why.
AKYA could have been made for the Milden and the older subs(after upgrade) in mind.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

Possibly reverse engineering? In the current serial production block/version XY of the Seahaks to improve their own Akya torpedoes?
Because it makes no sense for me to rely on German ammunition either... instead of converting the old submarines to the Turkish ammunition types (last cheaper), let's be honest, you can also develop your torpedoes in the same diameter and length of the Seahake, then it would only be a question of software to accept them as torpedoes and shoot them down, unless..... we are lied to all the time and our torpedo ammunition are blenders and are no good.

 

[Osman]

Do we know the mod of the seahakes that will come? If it is the newest dm2a4 ER, with slow attack mode its range is 150 km. DM2A4 is really a good torpedo and other variants' range with slow attack mode is 100 km (see Sünnetçi's article below) I dont know if Akya reached these ranges (most probably) but Akya should need some time to improve its capabilites. Besides, we still use mk 37s and tigersharks (which had some guidance promlems twice in our exersices). And our submarine fleet will become larger (14- 16 subs instead of 12) within 4 or 5 years. And I heard that submarine crew prefer having different types of torpedoes in their subs in order to decrease risks and increase the surprise effect against enemy's anti torpedo measures. Therefore ı dont question the navy's choice.


Please read İbrahim Sünnetçi's article on torpedoes in TN's inventory. You will see the capabilities of dm2a4.

Türkiye'de Torpido Çalışmaları ve DzKK Torpido Envanteri

DzKK Ora. Adnan ÖZBAL, Cumhurbaşkanı Recep Tayyip ERDOĞAN ve MSB Hulusi AKAR'a AKYA Milli Ağır Torpido mock-up'ı üzerinden torpidonun kabiliyetleri hakkında bilgi verirken görülüyor (Fotoğraf: Cumhurbaşkanlığı).

tr.linkedin.com

 

[UkroTurk]

I could understand the torpedo deal since there were complicated submarines..but why did they buy hundred RIM-116 while there were Göksur /Levent?

Throwing RAM launchers, creating Software for ship naval management system, producing 100 göksur missiles.. all of them would cost more than current situation?

I can't understand really so all Göksur, gürz, Levent etc are fake .

 

[chngr]

I could understand the torpedo deal since there were complicated submarines..but why did they buy hundred RIM-116 while there were Göksur /Levent?

Throwing RAM launchers, creating Software for ship naval management system, producing 100 göksur missiles.. all of them would cost more than current situation?

I can't understand really so all Göksur, gürz, Levent etc are fake .

Yeah cost much more...Why should we throw away the ready and good system we have?

 

[Shtr]

Maybe they forced us to buy remaining other packages.

 

[uçuyorum]

We don't "have" göksur and levent yet. Time is money, gentlemen

 

[boredaf]

I can't understand really so all Göksur, gürz, Levent etc are fake .

What kind of a logic is this? Honestly, do you guys really pay no real attention to process behind these things and just assume as soon as a name is mentioned we can use them? They are being developed *right now*, do you expect us to install them tomorrow?

Over and over, in almost all threads it has to be repeated that development and deployment (in meaningful numbers) of weapon systems of all kind (and ships, and vehicles, and planes etc) all take time. There is a lot of testing and tweaking involved and there can be setbacks in any phase of development, it is normal, borderline expected to have some even.

In this case, we have ships and submarines at hand that use these weapons systems and need munitions (missiles and torpedoes), why wouldn't we also order some while developing ours? Funding for development and procurement are usually separated from each other at any rate (or should be), so, one shouldn't effect the other at all.