TR Navy Turkish Navy|News & Discussions

[UkroTurk]

İf you want to operate your subs under deep water 100% of their operational range , you need nuclear submarines.



Turkish Navy needs mini nuclear submarines. I think it is time to construct 2000 tons nuclear submarines.

For sure we need to create a mini-reactor.

Rumors emerge about China's development of a new Type 041 submarine

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armyrecognition.com

submarines are expected to be between 2,000 to 4,000 tons, much smaller than traditional nuclear submarines.

A key feature under discussion is the Air-Independent Propulsion (AIP) system. AIP allows submarines to operate without the need for atmospheric oxygen, enhancing their stealth and operational efficiency. While conventional submarines with AIP have been successful, they still face limitations in shallow waters due to their noise levels and detectable activity footprints.

In contrast, nuclear-powered submarines, which inherently possess AIP capabilities, offer significant advantages. These submarines can operate with low noise levels, making them difficult to detect. Unlike AIP submarines that need to maintain low speeds and extreme caution in shallow waters, nuclear-powered submarines can move quickly and cover greater distances without compromising stealth.

 

[boredaf]

Turkish Navy needs mini nuclear submarines. I think it is time to construct 2000 tons nuclear submarines.

... Maybe we should get nuclear reactors first? No?

 

[UkroTurk]

... Maybe we should get nuclear reactors first? No?

ÇNAEM - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Istanbul Technical University TRIGA Mark-II Training and Research Reactor - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I don't think for Türkiye it is a big problem.

 

[boredaf]

ÇNAEM - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Istanbul Technical University TRIGA Mark-II Training and Research Reactor - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I don't think for Türkiye it is a big problem.

Ah yes, that is why we have and are building our own nuclear reactors instead of foreign countries building and owning them. And, of course, they have already managed to get through everything necessary to make a naval nuclear reactor and were just sitting on it for the fun of it. Naturally, it wouldn't be a big problem.

 

[UkroTurk]

Ah yes, that is why we have and are building our own nuclear reactors instead of foreign countries building and owning them. And, of course, they have already managed to get through everything necessary to make a naval nuclear reactor and were just sitting on it for the fun of it. Naturally, it wouldn't be a big problem.

How Soviets created their first nuclear reactor 80 years ago? Jesus didn't gift them. 80 years has passed over the first primitive reactor technology.

 

[Yasar_TR]

yours is a valid concern... yet not only ISR i.e Intelligence, Surveillance, Reconnaissance tasks but over all mission profile of a sub require situational awareness and sensor mix which may be beyond the capabilities of a observation drone with a fiber optic cable

However, Germans will have two optronic masts on their new submarines, one for extended capabilities and one for stealth ok more like a Ultra-low Profile Mast replacing the periscope. .. a combination of OSM150 and OMS300....definity something we should also try on MILDEN

Gür Class and Preveze Class subs, if I am not mistaken, use Hensoldt Sero-400 optronic periscope systems. In their MLU, it was programmed that they were updated. There were also some work undertaken by our companies, to make the close to surface parts, stealthy.

SERO 400 Family - High-end Periscopes for Submarines | HENSOLDT

The SERO 400 series represents the most successful periscope systems for submarines since more than a decade.

www.hensoldt.net

In contrast, nuclear-powered submarines, which inherently possess AIP capabilities, offer significant advantages. These submarines can operate with low noise levels, making them difficult to detect. Unlike AIP submarines that need to maintain low speeds and extreme caution in shallow waters, nuclear-powered submarines can move quickly and cover greater distances without compromising stealth.

The modern AIP submarines are Infact a good deal stealthier than the nuclear powered ones. Those big nuclear Subs do create more noise, than the smaller AIP subs like our REİS class.

Quote:

It's a significant improvement over traditional diesel-electric propulsion systems used in non-nuclear submarines. Interestingly, new-gen non-nuclear vessels equipped with AIP or battery systems can be nearly noiseless, making them stealthier than nuclear submarines.

Unquote.

https://testbook.com/articles/aip-technology-air-independent-propulsion-technology#:~:text=It's%20a%20significant%20improvement%20over,them%20stealthier%20than%20nuclear%20submarines.

Of course for the nuclear powered subs, having the advantage of staying submerged for 90 days at a time (they need to come up to replenish food etc) is a big thing. Also to have possibility to apply the high speed whenever and as often as you can is an unquestionable plus.

 

[somegoodusername]

What are the causes for MKE’s bad reputation ?

The first thing we need to clarify is that most of the failures and setbacks in MKE's projects occurred before the changes in administration and reforms in the managerial system. MKE is a 70-year-old, government-run company, and like most government-run organizations, it was highly bureaucratic and not very productive. With the new reforms, it is now planned to be evolve something more closer to TAI or ASELSAN, government-owned on paper but run more like a private firm.

 

[UkroTurk]

new-gen non-nuclear vessels equipped with AIP or battery systems can be nearly noiseless, making them stealthier than nuclear submarines.

AFAIK there is no Stealth submarines in shallow waters like the Egean Sea. In shallow waters the subs could be detected.

 

[boredaf]

How Soviets created their first nuclear reactor 80 years ago? Jesus didn't gift them. 80 years has passed over the first primitive reactor technology.

There is a massive difference in "We can get there eventually, sooner or later" and "It won't be a big problem". And there is a reason only 6 countries have nuclear submarines, actually, several billion reasons, and problem of reactors is just one of them.

 

[UkroTurk]

There is a massive difference in "We can get there eventually, sooner or later" and "It won't be a big problem". And there is a reason only 6 countries have nuclear submarines, actually, several billion reasons, and problem of reactors is just one of them.

So you ownself answered to your first question.
I don't like personal dialogue here.

 

[Yasar_TR]

AFAIK there is no Stealth submarines in shallow waters like the Egean Sea. In shallow waters the subs could be detected.

For a large SSN it needs about 20metres of water under its kiel to be stealthy.
For a SSK size this is under 15 metres.
As submarines move closer to the bottom while sailing, they cause a lot of disturbance that bounce back from the bottom. That is why a good depth of water is needed under it’s kiel.
Aegean is not as shallow as you may think. Its deepest is 3450m. It averages 362metres.
there is a lot of the Aegean that is much deeper than any submarine can possibly submerge.
Baltic Sea is shallower than the Aegean. If memory serves it averages 55metres. The 212 Class AIP subs were constructed with anti magnetic shell especially for this sea. Both Sweden and Germany build AIP subs specifically suited to the Baltic.

If a sub is deeper than 20-40 metres it is difficult to detect it. In tropical warm waters it may be 30 to 40 meters. But in colder waters it may be 20metres.
Also It depends how well a sub commander can place it against the terrain to camouflage it’s sonar signature.

 

[TheInsider]

Boran is not a niche product, it's a 105mm gun built to replace hundreds of 70 year old M101 and M116s in service. If anything, 76mm gun is the niche product that will maybe see 50-60 built during its production cycle discounting spare barrels, if we're lucky.

Boran was exported to Macedonia and Bangladesh, per claims by giving lines slated for KKK. Boran production is woefully slow. Per 2022 reports, Macedonia will get 6 Borans in 2 years and 12 more between 2029-2031.
"The first battery, each consisting of 6 BORAN Howitzers, is planned to be delivered to the Macedonian Army within 2 years, while the remaining 2 batteries are planned to be delivered to the Macedonian Army in 2029-2031."

Makedonya'dan BORAN Obüsü Siparişi | SavunmaSanayiST

Makedonya, Türkiye'ye 18 adet BORAN Obüsü siparişi verdi. Her birinde 6 adet obüs olan 3 batarya BORAN Obüsü, Makedonya Ordusu'na teslim edilecek.

www.savunmasanayist.com

In the original document signed in 2009, MKE was to deliver 104 Borans to army in 54 months or 4.5 years. That's 12 a year. We have more than 500 old mid caliber guns in service. Changing all of them(not currently planned or ordered) would take 20 years.
"For the 105mm Boran Howitzer Project, the Mechanical and Chemical Industry Corporation is developing the weapon system and Aselsan is developing the fire control system. According to the first contract, the contract period for the development of the howitzer was signed for 49 months, while the serial production phase of 106 105 mm howitzers was signed for 54 months."

Havadan Taşınabilir Obüs (BORAN) Projesi ve Özel Detaylar

Dağlık alanda ve arazide operasyonel birliklerin ihtiyacı olan yoğun ateş desteğinin düşmana görüntü vermeden sağlanması söz konusu olduğunda, akla ilk gelen düşük maliyetli silah sistemlerinin başında havadan taşınabilir hafif çekili obüsler gelmektedir. Soğuk savaşın sona ermesinden sonra...

www.defenceturk.net

Pretty normal to expect something similar for the 76mm gun and I will reserve my judgment whether MKE can deliver on time.

CUMHURİYET TARİHİNİN İLK OBÜS İHRACATI - BORAN - MAKİNE ve KİMYA ENDÜSTRİSİ A.Ş

CUMHURİYET TARİHİNİN İLK OBÜS İHRACATI - BORAN - MAKİNE ve KİMYA ENDÜSTRİSİ A.Ş

www.mke.gov.tr

Bangladeş’e BORAN Obüsü teslimatı: Tarihte bir ilk | SavunmaSanayiST

MKE, Bangladeş'e yönelik BORAN Obüsü teslimatına başladı. BORAN Obüsü'nün ihracatı, Türkiye Cumhuriyeti tarihinde bir ilk olma özelliğine sahip.

www.savunmasanayist.com

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1800786388360614048

MKE delivered 25 Boran so far this year. TSK ordered 114. There are also export orders. Total orders are around 150.

 

[Sanchez]

As expected Seems COs of Wasp, 4th amphip group and the 24th MEU also visited Anadolu. We haven't seen much about it in the media, but this was a pretty big occasion. Less so for the training but the diplomacy part.

WSP ARG-24th MEU (SOC) Conducts Bilateral Exercise with Turkish Navy

MEDITERRANEAN SEA (Aug. 17, 2024) Capt. Christopher Purcell, commanding officer of the amphibious assault ship USS Wasp (LHD 1), receives the gift of a command ballcap from Turkish Naval Forces Capt. Nadir Kilinc, commanding officer of the amphibious assault ship TCG Anadolu (L 400), during a...

www.dvidshub.net

I had missed this video. Looks like two different V-22s landed on Anadolu during the exercise.

 

[Strong AI]

STM will launch the production entirely in Türkiye of “CTD Probe” systems, which are used aboard oceanographic research and naval vessels to collect data on the physical properties of seawater.

------------------

STM - Oceanography Devices Produced with Local Resources

www.stm.com.tr

STM - Academic and Industrial Collaboration Delivers Essential Local System for Blue Homeland

www.stm.com.tr

 

[valarmogu]

Türkiye’s Marlin USV enhances capabilities with new 8-tube launcher.​

In previous tests, Marlin could only fire a single Kuzgun missile. However, thanks to the new launcher, Marlin can fire 8 missiles at the same time.

Marlin SİDA : 8 Adet Kuzgun Füzesine Sahip Lançer Entegre Edildi! - ULU Savunma

Marlin SİDA Tarafından ateşlenen Kuzgun KY modeli yaklaşık 20 kilometre (12,4 mil) menzil sunarak platformun stratejik caydırıcılığını artırmaktadır.

www.ulusavunma.com

 

[dBSPL]

I wish the ASW rocket launcher on the stern deck of Tuzla Class Patrol boats could be positioned further inwards, the mine shedding rails could be positioned portably and a 25 ton capacity crane (or towing system) and USV transport cradle could be replaced according to the type of mission. We have 16 Tuzla type patrol boats. In this way, Armed type Unmanned Surface Vehicles can be launch, and launched very quickly on these boats. The boats that are resupplied and maintained in these patrol boats can be made ready again before they arrive at the base, increasing both the mission radius and the endurance of the unmanned boats. I assume that there are sufficient technical facilities and space inside the patrol boat for additional operator consoles.

 

[Strong AI]

Beauty

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1834559734646456539

 

[Sanchez]

According to MEE, Turkey is "planning to deploy two frigates and additional auxiliary ships" in Somalia to guard Orucreis survey ship which will be deployed to Somalia next month.

Turkey to deploy frigates to guard energy exploration ship in Somalia

Ankara will send Oruc Reis research vessel to Somali waters next month to conduct energy exploration activities and naval ships to protect it

www.middleeasteye.net

This is almost 15% of our frigate force. Hisars can't come quick enough.

 

[somegoodusername]

According to MEE, Turkey is "planning to deploy two frigates and additional auxiliary ships" in Somalia to guard Orucreis survey ship which will be deployed to Somalia next month.

Will they pass from the Red Sea? If so, it will be interesting to watch.

 

[Sanchez]

Will they pass from the Red Sea? If so, it will be interesting to watch.

Doubt it, but we'll see. 2 Tuzlas that were sent to Qatar recently were transported on a ship that traversed Good Hope. Maybe they'll run the gauntlet, it would be interesting to watch. In that case, I'd expect at least one Gabya to be sent. If they'll traverse, both probably will be Gabyas.

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Mk-41 Mod 8 on F246 Salihreis, and Midlas on Istanbul.

source.