TR Air Defence Programs

[Afif]

You might want to look through earlier pages. If I remember correctly, @Anmdt had said a few times that Hisar-D (based on Hisar RF) and Siper's first block (based on Hisar-RF + booster) will be quadpacked as this is a requirement by the Navy. Ibrahim Sunnetci also confirmed the quadpacked Siper a few months ago. It seems quadpacking will not finish in time for the first frigate, though.

Yes, HISAR-D and SIPER block II. (Not the current block iirc. Let's not tag him anymore on this topic. He made it clear so many times, now he is really going to be annoyed)

 

[Heartbang]

Siper Block 2 is the real Siper and it won't be quadpacked.
Siper Block 1 (Hisar RF with a booster) will be quadpacked.

Been telling this for a year or so. I am tired.

@godel44 @Afif @UkroTurk

I attached the relevant post above as a reminder.

 

[UkroTurk]

@godel44 @Afif @UkroTurk

I attached the relevant post above as a reminder.

İt makes more complicated. İf Siper Block 1 exist and could be quadpacked why will you need G40?
Why they are improving G40?

 

[AzeriTank]

İt makes more complicated. İf Siper Block 1 exist and could be quadpacked why will you need G40?
Why they are improving G40?

they just answered it, they would enlarge the Gokdogan missile and add some booster to fly longer distances. it will be with data link

 

[Heartbang]

İt makes more complicated. İf Siper Block 1 exist and could be quadpacked why will you need G40?
Why they are improving G40?

If Gökdoğan is the Turkish AMRAAM, G40 would be the the Turkish AMRAAM-ER. Basically a chunkier, beefier, more capable Fox-3.

AMRAAM-ER equipped NASAMS-3 has a range of 50 km's compared to 30 km's with the regular AMRAAM's. Quite an improvement.

Also could be used in place of the ESSM's to do point defence in navy ships. In fact, it would be better than the block-1 ESSM's since those are semi-active radar homing missiles, meaning they require radar illumination from the ship itself, limiting their response against swarming missile fire.

 

[Tornadoss]

İt makes more complicated. İf Siper Block 1 exist and could be quadpacked why will you need G40?
Why they are improving G40?

Gurcan Okumus said that there is technology but there is no request yet form Navy/SSB to materialize the G-40 and it's on hold. So most likely it won't turn into product.

 

[UkroTurk]

Gurcan Okumus said that there is technology but there is no request yet form Navy/SSB to materialize the G-40 and it's on hold. So most likely it won't turn into product.

Could we assume Hisar O+ RF( siper block 1 without booster) could be quadpacked and Turkish Navy will use it instead of ESSM?

IMO Siper block 1 (with booster ) won't be mass produced. We will see Siper Block 2 in navy and in the ground SAM systems.

Still i don't understand how they could quadpacked Hisar0+RF for hot launch.

 

[NitricAcid]

Isrealis Are Always Ahead Of Game

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1669051950850007070

 

[Huelague]

Isrealis Are Always Ahead Of Game

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1669051950850007070

Only if you believe they are the chosen people. Anything else is a myth.

 

[UkroTurk]

@Yasar

Dear what is your opinion about 30x173mm smart ammunition ?

The ammunition could be used in Turkish warship against Cruise missiles?:
(162x1,24g tungsten subprojectiles could stop?)
"The alternative name of this ammunition is KE-TF. Its a time fused projectile that uses a small explosive charge of 0.5g to eject 162 cylindrical subprojectiles made out of 1.24g of tungsten. The timed fuse is programmed at the muzzle of the gun to explode infront of the target and shower it in subprojectiles. It flies at 1075 m/s just like the HEI-T"
This turret weights just 2.5 tons

Here is the 35mm smart ammunition:
"Each round disperses 152 small tungsten projectiles weighing 3.3 grams (0.12 oz) each to form a lethal cone-shaped cloud to strike the incoming target."
But it weights 4.5 ton.

Look even single burrel Göker how bulky is.

Wouldn't be great 30*173mm Göker for our frigates?

 

[Afif]

@UkroTurk Gokdeniz already uses Aselsan's 35m ATOM smart ammunition.

 

[UkroTurk]

@UkroTurk Gokdeniz already uses Aselsan's 35m ATOM smart ammunition.

So what? Do you think i didn't know?

@Yasar instead of 35mm , 30mm Göker wouldn't be more compact as well as effective?

 

[Afif]

So what? Do you think i didn't know?

Then what is the point of proposing Goker for frigates when it already has Gokdeniz?



Edit-

instead of 35mm , 30mm Göker wouldn't be more compact as well as effective?

Did they develop 30mm version of Göker yet?

 

[Heartbang]

Isrealis Are Always Ahead Of Game

IDK man, looks like vaporware to me

 

[Afif]

idk man, looks like vaporware to me

Wait until the air show starts. (Let’s see what product they unveil) Even without that, current David's sling should be quite capable against Russian/Iranian 'hypersonic' weapons.

 

[zio]

Then what is the point of proposing Goker for frigates when it already has Gokdeniz?



Edit-


Did they develop 30mm version of Göker yet?

The point is göker can be used on both side of ship so it can be fired at the same time on both sides,so the ship become more resistant to multible attacks,the other point is göker canbe used at more fire angle than gökdeniz this also gives immunity to high angle attacks.If the fire rate of 500/dk is enough double göker is better than single gökdeniz

 

[Heartbang]

Even without that, current David's sling should be quite capable against Russian/Iranian 'hypersonic' weapons.

That would be due to the inadequacy of the Russo-Iranian "hypersonics", not because of the Israeli ingenuity.

 

[Heartbang]

Do we know the gun barrel traverse angle of GOKDENIZ CIWS?

 

[UkroTurk]

The point is göker can be used on both side of ship so it can be fired at the same time on both sides,so the ship become more resistant to multible attacks,the other point is göker canbe used at more fire angle than gökdeniz this also gives immunity to high angle attacks.If the fire rate of 500/dk is enough double göker is better than single gökdeniz

Current Gökdeniz even Göker systems are heavy and bulky. They engage too much space on the ship.


Imagine as if Göker used 30x173cal smart ammunition, the gun system would be lighter and more compact.

Again imagine as if Istif Class Frigates had:

Port and starboard: 2 X 30mm Göker
FORE and AFT : 2 X LEVENT


And 8 cell VLS

 

[Era_shield]

Current Gökdeniz even Göker systems are heavy and bulky. They engage too much space on the ship.


Imagine as if Göker used 30x173cal smart ammunition, the gun system would be lighter and more compact.
View attachment 58435

Again imagine as if Istif Class Frigates had:

Port and starboard: 2 X 30mm Göker
FORE and AFT : 2 X LEVENT


And 8 cell VLS

35mm ATOM/AHEAD type munitions are already too small to be effective against some threats, which is why we are still putting Phalanx on new ships. If anything we should move to 40mm ATOM or larger.